KISS ME, KATE, BEFORE…YOU KNOW…
Plus: Does Wang care? And about that hockey game
10:10 pm - Kate Murray’s response to Newsday.
Mark Herrmann says the NYI must stay.
Katie Strang has fan reaction at the Coliseum.
Kansas City fans want the Islanders. From the KC Star.
9:30 pm - I really want to believe in Kate Murray. She is the community leader of my Town and has done some very good things there. She has had a remarkable career thus far, taking her to enormous heights and perhaps some day even greater ones.
But I would feel so much better about the Town of Hempstead Supervisor if she’d stop spooning out nonsense or – if she truly means what she’s saying - at least get her facts straight.
Ms. Murray wants everyone to know that she has graciously offered to developers Charles Wang and Scott Rechler to start their major overhaul of the Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum now. That’s lovely.
Besides the obvious – the development doesn’t work without, you know, the development – there’s one other flaw to the Town Supervisor’s offer.
It is not her offer to make. The NVMC is the property of the County of Nassau. When Nassau put out its Request for Proposals years ago, Wang won the bid based on his entire proposal. The project cannot be changed unless the County and the Lighthouse Development Group agree on it. As Tom Suozzi told me, he doesn’t want it changed.
So go ahead, Kate: keep making the hollow offer and telling everyone about it. Makes you sound like a politician, and I hope for better from you.
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As for the persistent question in Comments about whether all Charles Wang cares about is the land and not the hockey team…
- If that were true, Wang would have desperately tried to unload the team years ago, when he may have begun to realize the project was going to go through a decade of red tape and political hot-potatoing. He probably wouldn’t find any takers. It’s very likely Wang is the last Islanders owner standing.
- Ever try talking to Wang in the middle of an Islanders game? I did once. Once.
- The Islanders had owners before Wang who only cared about the real estate and not the team. Those were the gentlemen who tried to get the payroll down to $5 million but settled for $14 million after Milbury got heated. Those were the gentlemen who had me drafting press releases about the trading of Zigmund Palffy to the Rangers and the Kings.
- If you saw Wang at the supermarket and said to him, “You only care about the property and not the Islanders,” he would probably…
1) initially laugh out loud, thinking about all the people who tell him he cares too much about the team and is too involved, and then
2) reflecting on all the coin he has lost when even a sold-out Coliseum the last 8 years with this lease would have him in the red, Wang would openly sob.
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Finally, about today’s news of the Islanders agreeing to play an exhibition game in Kansas City, this is what I can tell you. As I make no secret of, I worked for the Islanders for a long time, the final 8 years for Charles Wang. I was involved on the Lighthouse side of the business and have intimate knowledge of how the Islanders wanted to approach the project from a PR perspective for every day of those 8 years.
Wang bought the team almost 9 years ago. You never saw even the slightest hint of public acknowledgement that the problems were serious enough for the Islanders to think of being anywhere other than Nassau County. Until today.
My house on the line, do I think ultimately a deal can be struck and the Islanders will stay here? Yes.
But I would take today’s news very, very seriously.
*
Meanwhile, back to hockey…
The Islanders lost 2-1 to Boston, out-shooting them after two periods 29-15 and out-chancing them in that stretch by about a 3-1 ratio. Inability to finish continued in the third until a Bill Guerin billiards shot off Kyle Okposo‘s skate with 53 seconds left. But you’ve heard it all before, so we’re moving on.
Sean Bergenheim, said by the team to have been given the day off on Wednesday, out tonight with what the team termed a “strained side.” Jon Sim back in.
I get a kick out of my buddy Zdeno Chara completely eliminating opponents with the kind of checks he got penalized for every game of his rookie season with the Islanders. Good for him. Tim Thomas, perhaps well aware The New York Times is doing a feature on him, put on a solid show. What a story that guy is.
Scott Gordon was patrolling the bench like a wildman, offering instruction and encouragement throughout. At times, I could hear him from the press box.
Official attendance: 15,548. Scouts at the game: Minnesota, Phoenix, Dallas, Vancouver.
Hate to be a hag, but I freaking detest the sight of Kyle Okposo playing the point on the power play. He’s 20 years old. Let the kid be a power right wing.
Wade Dubielewicz is signed. Let’s talk about that more when he shows up, probably tomorrow.
An announcement on Rick DiPietro may come Friday.
David Krejci and Matt Hunwick had some enlightening stuff to say to me before the game about Coach Go-Go. It wasn’t your standard “He helped me a lot” stuff, so I’m going to save it for another day.
Don’t think you’ll see a trade between now and the start of All-Star Weekend.
Comments.
112 Responses to KISS ME, KATE, BEFORE…YOU KNOW…
Plus: Does Wang care? And about that hockey game
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Macch says:
How how can we make our voices heard? I know writing Murray, but she seems to use the enviromental review as a cop out. How can we push this thing??
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Aim says:
I do think Charles cares about the NYI but I also think he knows Zippo about how to properly run and manage a professional hockey team. I have no faith none whatsoever in this management properly running an NHL team and again that is where my problem lies. Good hockey people will not work here for CW. Talk to people in hockey and they smirk or make a silly comment about the Islanders. We are stuck with the Snow’s and Gordons of the world while the quenvilles tell the NYI they want to take a year off and then take an NHL job 2 weeks into the season for another team. CW chould turn the hockey business over to a TRUE hockey person. That would satisfy me. Chris Dey is a very nice man but he knows zero about hockey. 10 years of this crap is enough. If the decision makers in the Lighthouse process saw a true professional sports franchise in Nassau County instead of a once proud franchise that has turned into the worst running joke in professional sports maybe things would speed up.
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beatlebailey says:
really good crowd tonight considering the really crappy weather during rush hour. Man if this team was a consistent winner they would sell out every game
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isles316 says:
15,000 on a weeknight!??! That I don’t remember seeing since the 02-03 season. Good work!
Hopefully Newsday does the right thing and makes this the cover story and it wakes some people up.
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Strummer's Army says:
I have NOOOOOOOO problem with Wang the owner, I am THANKFUL FOR HIM.
Okposo is just turning great before our eyes.
Please dump Sim and Martinek.
Very interesting about Pho and Minn traling us for two games in a row. Not too mention I don’t believe either us or Boston play those teams nor Dallas or Van again this season.
From Van I’d want Biekska and/or Kesler.
From Dallas: Fistric D
From Minn: I’d have to research it. Boogard would be nice. lol
From Pho: Again I’d need to research it.Kate Murray and the little games she is playing with the lighthouse is costing Wang and this team millions, badly hurting the local economy and preventing the Isles from quickly returning to greatness.
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mrlbem says:
Newsday already has Murray’s response. It’s going to be a war.
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Dan says:
Is there any direct email address to Murray’s office? I am not sure. Thanks.
And also from the looks of it from tv, the NVMC looked pretty full tonight. Does anyone have the attendence?
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Islander505 says:
Bravo CB…
BEST blog you have ever written….
And how ’bout that apparent “change of attitude” by our Newsday buddies. (compared to last year)
And keep those Ice Girls comin’!!!
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Very interested to learn where the Isles may be holding training camp this year per the Howie and Jaffe tease. Not Eastern Canada, perhaps in KC or somewhere close? I don’t think they’ll go West Coast anywhere as it would be a bit tough or late with the training camp updates, Southern US?
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d says:
Aim… post #3… “Talk to people in hockey and they smirk or make a silly comment about the Islanders.” really? you speak to professional hockey people all the time and bring this up? gimme a break…
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this is from logan’s Newsday interview with Murray:
Asked if she’s worried that the Islanders might leave Long Island, Murray said, “Of course I wouldn’t want to see the Islanders leave, but that will be a business decision by Mr. Wang and his associates that he makes for his own well-being.”
She sounds like a fat and happy politician. She needs to feel some pressure. I know this has been discussed before but when she is up for re-election. We need to pressure the heck out of her. If the Devils can get 200 mil from Newark than the TOH can fast track this deal!!! -
DaveyD says:
I have no idea why the town of Hempstead would not want to partake in something so big that would generate over 50,000 new jobs for people in this struggling economy. 905 of the people taking these jobs will prob be from long island also that helps out even more
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Outside says:
have the camp in suffolk county.. that would really start getting stuff going.. hey suffolk wants us, so move it or lose it! (bring them back to the rinx in hauppague!), teh the fans should pack the rinx to the brim to make a point..
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West Coast Fan says:
I really hope Wang is in good health. If anything happens to him, we’re toast…
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D as a matter of fact I do talk to NHL people and I do bring this up!! I am not claiming to be the guy with the fake rumour board by any means BUT go to Kings Park Ice Arena where Pat LaFontaine coaches the LI Royals. Go to a NJD game and see Chico afterwards Go to Florida where u can speak openly to Denis Potvin yes I know people around the league too Not on a hey lets go out with the family to dinner but by going to an NHL rink and saying his to someone and hearing what they have to say about the state of the NYI. Travel around a bit you would be suprised who you run into and what they have to say about the NYI
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Standing O for CB on this article.
Kate Murray gave a politician’s answer to the question. Did anybody really expect her to tell Greg Logan or anybody else that she was scared and would approve the project tomorrow because of this?
The environmental review is a big obstacle. Everyone I’ve spoken to in Nassau County says it could take 12-18 months. We’re in Month 7, and let’s remember an inadequate review could lead to a challenge that puts us right back at Square One. There is nothing that can be done to solve this.
This is an article BD (and I?) wrote for Hockeybuzz back in November, and it spells out the statutory component of this, and the expected timeline of events (in sequential order, at this point my dates may be off):
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=18073
I would love to know why the Town of Hempstead has never once spoken about the benefits, and I hope we can eventually get an answer about that. The way to pressure her is to VOTE and SHOW UP to the hearings. All those of you who don’t live in the TOH should still write in since you visit and spend money in the TOH because of the Islanders.
I want to talk to some people in our little citizen group about other ways we can step up more publicly. However, let’s never forget that this is a fairly standard dark period due to the environmental review.
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Eric says:
I think I can speak for all Isles fan under 30: Being a fan of this team is the most unrewarding experience of my life. Year after year I root for the team to overachieve and make the 6th, 7th or 8th spot. I just keep hoping that one day they’ll be a team on the ice that is respected, competes and is in the playoffs year after year. Now that may only happen in Kansas City. I’m running out of hope and if something doesn’t break our way soon (i.e. approval of the project, team improving, DP not being injured) I may completely lose my S–t….I really don’t know how much more I can take.
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CB I guess I cant paste part of a Newsday article as i see it has been removed…sorry if I violated anything there. But check out a paragraph Mark Hermman wrote in the article about the way CW runs the team. It is exactly the point I and so many others wanted to make
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Glenn says:
Tavares would look horrid in a Kansas City jersey. CB, I think this calls for another Point Blank Night at some fine Long Island establishment to discuss!
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Joe in Massapequa says:
Let me ask you guys something, and I know this is a little off topic. But, hypothetically, let’s say we can bring the Nets back to Long Island and have a second team playing in the coliseum. You know they would get a min. of 15k a game. Does that help this process at all? I am not sure where they stand with the Brooklyn plan but I have thought about this over and over.
There would be two pro franchises at the site. If any sort of project gets put through, now that is 80+ days of fans going to the site just for games (roughly 25% of the year). Throw on top of that any sort of conventions that we can land plus general shopping and we would start to buzz. I am just trying to have an open mind here to get anything to work to make sure the Islanders remain the ISLANDERS (and not the Corn Fielders).
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blitz says:
The obvious part here is that Ms. Murray almost always talks of the project in the negative light AND against Wang.
As CB said, she is NOT the decision maker here – the County already did that.
It appears she’s trying to play coy b/c the issue is too big for her to ‘lay it all on the line’ or she’s waiting for the ‘ol NY kickback…
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What’s kind of funny is reading the repsonsive posts to the KC Star article on the game… kind of opposite of the sentiment we’re seeing here. Note:
“just another ploy by an out of town franchise to gain leverage in their fair cities. Take a hike New York !!”
dbates wrote on 1/15/2009 7:07:00 PM:
delray88,
“I couldn’t agree more. What a waste of money to put up such a nice areana in cow town. Hockey is not for this city, because everyone has there minds on the lowly Chiefs. Go figure!”delray88 wrote on 1/15/2009 6:13:07 PM:
“Enjoy the pre season game KC as its the only pro hockey you will get. KC is not a hockey town, despite its shiny, new arena.”lol… optimists in every city, it seems…
anyway, here’s the link to the article…
http://www.kansascity.com/news/breaking_news/story/983516.html
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nkay says:
Murray says: “Of course I wouldn’t want to see the Islanders leave, but that will be a business decision by Mr. Wang and his associates that he makes for his own well-being.”
Not good PR, Kate. It would probably help if your image if you at least seemed to care about the best interests of LI, its residents and the fans of the NYI. Leaving LI would not be a business decision that Wang makes for his own business associates, it would be one that he will be forced to make as a result of your inability to act and realize what is necessary.
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mike 8 says:
Call, email, write. I have and will continue to do so.
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Joe #22 You think the lighthouse is in trouble?? The Brooklyn project is worse. Great point you bring out and I would love to see happen. I think that would be a MAJOR boost to things here. Do the Nets want to come here?? not sure about that but in a not to distant future maybe they do not have a choice….intresting
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guerin13 says:
i absolutey can not wait to throw this clueless buffoon out of office in november when she is up for election. i just sent her a very long letter telling her to get this done soon or we fire her in november. the democratic party now has a golden opportunity to finally throw the gop out of hempstead town hall. she’s opened the door for them. and how did we have 15,500 at the nvmc tonight?
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jethro09 says:
I am very concerned that this team is gone. I just think that there is no incentive for Kate Murray to come clean, be honest and address this project. All Kate Murray is concerned with is getting votes to stay in office. So, it should come as no surprise to anyone that she’s distorting facts about the project and talking out of both sides of her mouth. That’s how you get the most votes.
Unfortunately, there is not enough support for the Isles and the Lighthouse in the Town of Hempstead. For every die hard Isles’ fan in the Town of Hempstead/Nassau County, there are 4 or 5 people who don’t like hockey or could care less about hockey and the Islanders. This ratio is going to keep this project back-burnered. The county and town politicans are not going to push a controversial project such as the Lighthouse to the forefront when not enough people about the project or the Islanders.
I don’t know Kate Murray, but I’ll bet my last dollar she doesn’t like hockey and could give a damn about the Islanders. And I also don’t live in the Town of Hempstead, but I’ll bet that Murray is not getting any pressure from her constituents to push this project forward. Therefore, she is in no rush to approve the Lighthouse. The only way that’s going to change is if enough Town of Hempstead residents and voters get behind this project and let their politicans know that the Lighthouse is something that the majority of voters want. I hope it gets approved.
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AIM, I was at the game tonight and for a last place team there was life in the building. There is plenty of fans out there. Hell, they even came out in the nasty cold. And imagine if the Nets are here and land Lebron in a couple years. Everyone on LI will be walking around with their #23 Nets jerseys and the coliseum would be rockin’. It wouldn’t get much better than that to have a world class facility, two stable franchises, and a place where people would love to go and grab a cup of coffee.
I am a republican in the Town of Oyster Bay and one thing that the govt prides itself on regarding our town that it is still suburbia. There are not many apartments, we are not overcrowded with supersized malls, we have plenty of parks, etc. If the design of the plans (maybe the two 30 story towers) are problems for the TOH, then it needs to be known and they can be changed so we can get the ball rolling.
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I’m scared s***less right now. I’ve grown up with this team, never seen them win a playoff series (I wasn’t a serious fan when I was 2, for crying out loud) all in the hopes that when they finally won, it would be that much sweeter. As a Mets and Jets fan, too, I’ve seen my friends celebrate championship wins and playoff victories almost every year, while my teams sat dormant come post-season time. This was supposed to make it that much more special when we finally did break through. I can put up with a rebuild, with pain and suffering because it’s going to end sometime.
But if this team moves to Kansas City, or anywhere else, I’ll be absolutely devastated. I can’t imagine rooting for any other hockey team. Hell, I don’t even love hockey except for the Islanders–and I LOVE the Islanders. I don’t watch the Stanley Cup religiously, and skipped the Winter Classic because I’m not a hockey fan. I’m an ISLANDERS fan and to have that identity ripped from me would put the final nail in the coffin, to realize that life really is that meaningless.
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Dan from Westchester says:
It is quite interesting that you never hear of any benefits that this Lighthouse project might bring to the Island. Why is that?
Was actually surprised that Howie / Jaffe discussed the KC game topic. What was up with Jaffe’s tease about the location of next season’s camp? Not cool – especially with emotions running high after today’s announcement!
I don’t know how the everyone else here feels – but if CB is that concerned about the prospect that this team could move – then so am I.
As for the game – was thinking the same thing about Okposo on the point on the PP — WHY??? He really is the best player on the ice at times – loved when he threw Chara down to the ice and then almost scored.
Let’s get something organized soon – and get some momentum and support going for the LightHouse!
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Willis says:
Excellent article CB!
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i do find it a bit odd that on a night like tonight with the bad weather all day, that a thursday night non holiday situation game to draw 15K, the same time as a bunch of articles in newsday come up about the lighthouse project and the KC preseason news.. something isnt adding up.. where did the sudden influx of fans come from on a thursday night to see a game of first vs last?, and it was a legit 15K too, it wasnt some made up media number either.. the place was close to sold out..
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Mike from Oceanside says:
My take of the Supervisor’s statement is that it is the enormity of the project that Kate Murray opposes. I’d like her to publicly voice her concerns in an itemized fashion. Hey, I’m a ToH resident…I believe I’m entitled to an answer from a public servant…especially if they are acting -in what they believe- to be my best interests.
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Joe I too was there and was told that there were alot of freebies as far as the tix go and Suffolk PAL had a huge showing. Dont care how they got em there it is just nice to see a full vibrant house on a weekday again. The fan base is there no doubt but they are for the most part fuming over the maagement of the team and stopped coming. When CW 1st bought us the barn was empty. people came back in droves when CW actually improved the team god that 01-02 season was something special. Then the circus came to town and everyone got fed up and left again. If CW commits to winning puts a great product on the ice and closes the curtain on the circus yea people will come back again. Not sure if CW ever gets the trust back but if we win for a few years people will be cheering like crazy….hope for the best
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SIR WILLIAM says:
It’s amazing to me how people here thinks that by sending an email to Kate Murray she is going to be jump statred into action.
Murray is a politician (who just got re elected, by the way). Did anyone here ever think that a career politician may have already done a study on what the voters in her town think.
Is it out of the realm of possibility that Ms Murray and her staff may have already done their homework and that the answer on the Lighthouse Project is that the overwhelming majority of TOH residents don’t want it.Murray is extraordinarily cavalier in her attitude toward the whole thing. That tells me that she has some sort of knowledge that she’s not sharing…..SW
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Gary Bettman said on his radio show today that Charles Wang is not looking to move this team.. but did say the project had better go through.
Attendance tonight was benefited by the Modell’s Hockey week give away. Box office was mobbed and some didn’t get in until the beginning of the second period.
Nite! -
I have read everything that I could find on the Lighthouse project. I am CONFUSED.
Development rights and the concept for the project has been approved and granted to Mr. Wang.Does anyone know what the REAL hold up is?
I know what Murray sited was bogus. Has she said anything accurate that would indicate the development team or someone else needs to do something? Mr. Botta broke it down a few months ago to prove she was the only one holding anything up.So can someone please tell me what the hold up is?
Don’t worry fans, if the Isles leave I am sure you can go to the NVMC to hear Kate Murray recite her poetry. Hopefully the beer stands remain open.
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I saw on an earlier comment thread that someone mentioned that Boomer and the Mad Dog Wannabe were saying that the Isles should move the morning after the Ranger game. Is it true that Boomer was talking smack about the team after Mike Bossy graciously hosted this known Ranger fan at the team’s business club get together? If so, what a classless act.
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Dan says:
If Wang only cared about the land than why would he do so much bringing hockey to China and having Chinese kids play here. I think great to expand the sport over seas. I work for Major League Baseball and I look at what they are doing globally for the sport of baseball so kudos to Charles Wang.
I have been a season ticket holder for seven years and I plan on being an Islanders season ticket holder the rest of my life….
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Look for training camp next year to be held in a far away city in Canada not on the east coast
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Question if anyone can answer..
The Town of Hempstead has over 750,000 people living in it.
How many people does this project really effect negatively? Not that many people live right near the coliseum where it would really be that much of a problem.
Am I wrong?
If this doesn’t cost taxpayer money than why would someone in Garden City for example vote agaisnt it?
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MT says:
To #41 Boomer said he’d open a restaurant if the Lighthouse was approved. On the lighthouse website there’s an mp3 of their show.
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interesting line from the hermann article (which is a good read), ” My gut tells me someone else might buy the team and keep it here as long as there’s a good venue.” i wonder if he’s heard something about a prospective local buyer?
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Mike Bossy is greatness and a legend of his sport…..Boomer is….well……..a very average QB with the arm of a 4 yr old.
Guys there isn’t gonna be another owner on LI if it isn’t Wang. Who is going to wish to purchase the team and mostly pay for a renovated or new arena? No one!
I wonder how soon Wang could move the team? The Arena is ready. Maybe he should just get the Mayflower trucks and go.
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KP says:
What I don’t understand is how can a city like KC build a brand spanking new arena without a tenant and we can’t even refurbish one building here? It’s politicking at it’s best. Look at Murray and her so full of you know what quotes looking to pass the buck to Wang. It’s a joke, plain and simple.
I still say the game in KC is purely a coincidence, I don’t blame people for blowing it up to be some big deal. I don’t have rose colored glasses on and realize if the Lighthouse isn’t built, the Islanders are gone. I would hate to see them go anywhere.
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Playing the game in KC is no coincidence. They NEVER play outside the east coast for preseason games. I don’t remember in the last 18 years that they have done that once.
No way is it conincidence.
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49 KP on Jan 15th, 2009 23:59:46 said:
“I still say the game in KC is purely a coincidence, I don’t blame people for blowing it up to be some big deal. I don’t have rose colored glasses on and realize if the Lighthouse isn’t built, the Islanders are gone. I would hate to see them go anywhere.”I dont think it is a coincidence at all. After all, the people in KC know the list of teams to try and entice. They probably offered the Isles plenty of scratch for playing this game. It doesnt necessarily mean they are considering any of it.
I think whats happening here is a bit more like a woman letting a guy take her to a ritzy dinner when she knows that she isnt going to get serious with him once the check is paid. She doesnt mind because she gets treated nice, and he doesnt mind because hey- at least he feels like he has a chance.
In addition to that- I also feel that Wang is not looking at this in any serious way. To put a similar kind of analogy on this part, I think that what Charles is doing is the same as when a girl talks to another guy a lot at a party… with her boyfriend sitting there next to her. She doesnt do anything wrong technically, she does juuust enough to make him a little jealous. Maybe then he will realize what he’s got. I feel in my heart that Charles is devoted to LI, LI is the one that has to show her appreciation for that devotion.
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Good analogies, though I’m usually the guy the girlfriend ends up talking to. Rock on, TMC!
I was amused by those commenters over at the KC Star who are convinced they’re once again being used for leverage.
Also, big Lighthouse-related thing: according to the piece over on the Newsday site, they expect the environmental review document to be finished in 30-60 days. That means we should now see public comments somewhere in the April-June area (and the earlier theory of the 2009 groundbreaking being ambitious, that I’ve admitted a few times, is true). We need to, as citizens, seek updates from the Town of Hempstead and make sure they know there is demand to schedule these hearings in a timely manner.
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316 To answer your question. People don’t beleive Long Island politicians when they tell them that it won’t cost taxpayers anything.
Corruption has been a way of life in Nasau County forever. The people have lost faith in their government.Nick, Didnt’ the NYS Developement Corp put up money to finance the study on the Lighthouse. I may be wrong but it was several millions of dollars.
Where did that money come from?
The taxpayers of NY State.
So to say that this project won’t cost taxpayers a dime is not quite true…..SW -
mjisles says:
“I’ve always been encouraged to find ways to expand our fan base,” Snow said. “This is probably a hot-button topic because of the decision to play the game in Kansas City. But I’m being consistent in the way I’ve scheduled preseason games in the past. It’s a good opportunity to touch fans in a different market.”
Garth needs to step up here and give us a response that makes us confident the islanders will remain islanders. he failed today…
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SW, you’re nitpicking that, especially since the state naturally uses funds on all environmental reviews. The development of the Coliseum itself won’t cost a thing, and the very small share of public money that will be used largely comes from a state grant that was approved 10 years ago (again, the standard “public” stuff: sewers, plumbing, etc.).
The public funds that are put up dwarf the benefits that will come from increased tax revenue and lease payments. Let’s not forget the County loses $1.5 million on that facility every year as it is. Noted sports economist Andrew Zimbalist has blasted most sports projects because the public usually pays 75% of the stadium/arena costs. Here, when all’s said and done (talking the whole development), the share is projected to be less than 3%, not counting tax revenues and lease payments. What part of those numbers looks off to you, in all seriousness? Assuming corruption seems like a cop-out.
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Gents, Don’t worry about the Isles moving anywhere. At least 4 or 5 other NHL teams are on the brink of bankruptcy. Coyotes and Lightning had to borrow money from the NHL to meet expenses. Atlanta and Florida are going broke and Nashville is barely holding on. Anyone of them is a better candidate to move along than the Isles……SW
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Nick, all of it looks like bullspit to me. Tell me Nick is Wang putting up a bond to ensure that no taxpayer money is used?
And answer the question. How much money has already been spent that came out of taxpayers pockets?Just like the Yanklees and Mets halfway through the project we will find out that all the estimates were wrong and the cost is double or triple and somebody has to bail Wang out.
I’ve heard this song before…..SW -
Maybe someone can identify the town for me. I recall reading in the Newsday a while back about an indoor swimming pool from somewhere in Suffolk (I beleive) that developed a crack.
Original estimates were about 75,000 dollars to fix.
Three or four years later the cost had ballooned into millions and millions and the pool still wasn’t fixed.That’s exactly why people don’t trust politicians when they tell you it won’t cost you anything……SW
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Jim says:
Herrman was dead on. He basically said this is an awful team masquerading as a youth movement. And that is 100% accurate.
Can someone explain why Corey Trovino has just 1 college goal this season. You can say he is on a goood team, blah blah blah. Of all the college kids drafted in 08, in all rounds, he has the least impressive stats. Jimmy Hayes has 6 goals for BC. The kid Skokan the Ranger took 19 points in 24 games. The d-man the Devils took has impressive stats.
Seems the least impressive college players taken in the first three rounds are Trovino, Towes and Niess.
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JKP in Halifax says:
I don’t get how in a down economy begging for infrastructure spending that a government would hold up a private-funded mega project that can only bring more jobs, a beautiful development on a barren piece of land and additional long-term prosperity.
Am I missing something here, or is the politics of this really as asinine as it look from a distance?
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What is Recksons involvement here?? Notice you hear very little about that. The head of the Lighthouse development is Mike Picker who not a hockey person, not a real estate person, but a former exec at CA. Again if I am the TOH and I see the way CW has run his NHL franchise for the last 10 years do I want him running the largest construction project in the TOH. CW has stated about his strange management style that he does not care what people think about it he will do it his way. And what do we get from CW?? we will extend the Isles lease till 2025. big whoop that is not that far off considering a project this size is going to take 10 years to build. we would have the NYI for 3-5 years with a completed project before god knows what he will ask for or need for the new lease on the building. Do we really trust CW with this project?? I dont. I have seen too much over the last 10 years of watching him make a joke out of an NHL franchise. Herrman said it best in one single paragraph today
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dirk says:
Chris, scouts from Minnesota and Phoenix again at the game, do you think something special about that?
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Bryan says:
Kate Murray is just like every other person at the top of the “political” world. Politition or not she is looking for a way to have this butter her own pocket before giving it an approval. The entire world has gone corrupt.
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JayK says:
Joe, post #22: I was a huge Nets’ fan. When they left, I vowed to curse their name forever. When the Knicks beat them in the playoffs in ’83, the wound was still raw enough from their departure that I whooped like the Knicks had just won the NBA title. Even though with age I now realize that Roy Boe had little alternative but to sell Dr. J., I cursed him for years like an old Dodgers fan would have cursed Walter O’Malley.
That said, the market here is not going to support a return of the Nets AND the Islanders. (Do you know the Nets sold out one game at the Coliseum in their entire history: the deciding game of the ’76 ABA finals). Given that, I really don’t want the Nets back. Let’s just focus on the Isles. The market can’t support both.
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Scott W says:
It seems alot of people are quick to get all over Wang when he maybe the only reason we are still on the Island. He is a successful business man who wants bigger things for the coliseum. As a season ticket holder for the Isles, I love seeing other arenas. It is amazing how great a hockey experience you get going to a game the other arenas. However, the current coliseum is a joke. Grab a drink before a game…forget it. You can go to Doolins which is arena prices, or go to Champions and wait for one of the hags behind the bar to serve you a beer. Want to get a good meal? Champions is an hour wait for a table on weekends, or you can eay Crab Cakes for $30 at that stupid Bistro in the vacant basement of the coliseum. I have yet to see 1 person in that place. Look, Wang has made mistakes. His mistakes including trusting Milbury. I still am amazed how Milbury gets away with one of the worst jobs a GM can possibly do. We are still feeling the effects today!!! We have to cut Wang some slack though. This franchise is just not catching any bounces right now.
On a positive note: How about Okposo last night. Hit in the face, back with a full visor on. Heard his face swelled up a ton. This kid is a gamer!!!
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Matt Scordato says:
isles316 #44, Garden City residents are notorious for voting down everything, classic example of a NIMBY community.
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Pat says:
The way I see it, this is a long chess game, Charles made a move and Kate Murray countered.
However, why is Kate Murray so important in the process? This is the part I am having trouble with. Is this simply a zoning issue – and her problem is not so much with Wang as it is with Suozzi (Different political party ) ?
In the old days – even in 2000 – everything had to be run past Al D’Amato. I think he represented both Milstein AND Wang in the prior sale. (meaning he was paid by both sides)
I have to think that if it was as simple as writing a bigger check – there would already be shovels in ground. D’Amato would have provided for Kate Murray.
I find the off-ice story to me MUCH more compelling than the on – ice story.
How I wish this would change though, but this will take time to play out. Charles can position Kate to be the “Killjoy” in all this. Smart move. Where is Suozzi and D’Amato on this development. If I were Newsday – would send Mark Herrmann or Edie Laikin out to visit Mr. Suozzi – he has to keep a low profile until Gov. Patterson names a successor to Sen. Clinton.
But penny for Mr. Suozzi’s thoughts and Mr. D’Amato’s thoughts. ( I know that technically – D’Amato is not involved – TECHNICALLY)
Pat
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It is important to note that the normal NIMBY loudmouths are so far rather quiet on this one. Most of the public meetings have been positive. A meeting in Uniondale was somewhat negative, but all things considered, could have been worse from what I hear.
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1) How many arenas/stadia have been built in the NY area in the past 9 years? The isles should have done this stunt 5 years ago!
2) Nice outshooting the Bruins, but its a hollow victory as the Bruins win 85% of their games when they are outshot! -
Agree with post 64. Wang has kept his promise and wants the team here. We can all disagree with how he is going about it at times, but at least it is here and if you read Chris’s blog about how much he cares it’s encouraging.
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SW – we’re clearly looking at this from 2 different perspectives, and nothing either of us says will convince the other one. I think your reasoning is also bull because you’re assuming that incidents having nothing to do with this should be treated as gospel, and that there is obviously some sort of nefarious motive here. It’s a given that building something requires public outlay because the town/county handle police, fire protection, garbage, sewage, but that’s true for anybody and anything. Simply throwing up our hands in a defeatist manner doesn’t help anybody.
Aim asked about Rexcorp being involved – why shouldn’t they be? They own all the commercial buildings around the site, thus increasing size/scope/parking options, and they have extensive experience in land development. It’s funny that people piss and moan about getting hockey people in charge of the Islanders when at the same time wanting a police investigation because real estate people are looking after the real estate part of the plan. I don’t know jack about developing real estate; I know if I were in that position I’d want people who knew what they were doing (and who had deep pockets, let’s not forget the money part) helping me.
An earlier poster hit the nail on the head – something will exist on that site very shortly regardless of the ridiculous delusions to the contrary. I’d prefer a plan that keeps our team where it belongs.
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And JayK is dead-right. People are talking about community opposition that just isn’t there. I’ve been to every major hearing on the Town and County level, and the number of supporters far outweighs the number of opponents. This is a good project even for people who don’t love hockey like we do, which is smart politics.
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You know what I don’t get: If Wanger is truly in this for the Isles, why doesn’t he move forward on the coliseum for now, then finish the Lighthouse Project once approval from the TOH is obtained (in about 10 years)? The plans for the Coliseum renovation have already been approved by the County of Nassau as part of the overall Lighthouse Project. He can go forward on that renovation tomorrow if he wants to. All he may have to do is re-submit the Coliseum renovation proposal separately to the County, who undoubtedly would approve it immediately, since they already approved of the renovation in the overall Lighthouse proposal. Why not just go forward on that project to ensure the Isles will stay here and generate more money for the franchise? It makes me question Wang’s true intentions.
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Jethro, you’re not listening.
First of all, as CB has pointed out, Wang and Rexcorp have a deal with the county to develop the whole site. That’s the lease that they signed with the county, and it’s the lease that the county legislature approved with just two dissenting votes. (Including my legislator, Richard “Whatever it is, I’m against it” Nicolello.) The obligation is for the developer to redevelop the whole site. They can’t just suddenly go in and scale it back unilaterally.
I guess it’s possible for Wang to change his mind and go back to the county and say “We just want to do the arena.” But there is no economic model that shows that as profitable.
So even if Wang could just say to Hempstead “OK, we’ll just do the arena,” and we’ll do the rest later, which is what you suggest, he runs the risk that he won’t get the rest of the project approved later, and then he’s stuck with a money-losing stand-alone arena in, to use the phrase I’ve used before, a sea of asphalt. And a sea of red ink.
And he needs the county to say OK to that, and they don’t want that either.
It’s a fully integrated project, or nothing. That’s the economics of this situation.
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Moose says:
Wang should just pay her to approve it…it seems like that is what she is waiting for, any chance they will have a Kate Murray Dart Board Night
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Kyle says:
CB- this probably violates your comments guidelines, but hopefully you’ll give me a break on this. Any of you fans who have a facebook account, please join this group to save the Isles
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=45588234028
I did give PB a shout-out in the group but please join, get your friends to join and feel free to start wall posts and discussion comments.
CB for Town of Hempstead Supervisor!!!
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pete says:
Doesn’t seem like she cares much if they stay or go.
I guess once they leave they can raze the Mauseleum and put up more office space.
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rb says:
since I no longer live in Nassau County (and not even in NY) writing to Kate Murray would be useless…but what I can and will do – and maybe many more of us – is find out (1) when is she up for re-election; (2) will her opponent commit to moving this along; and (3) give and raise money to defeat her; and (4) let her know that a mobilized, angry fan base will do everything contributions-wise to defeat her…that’s the only way these people get the message
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She is up for re-election.
It will be interesting to see if her opponent comes out and supports this. The sad thing is that being against development in an area that is reasonably affluent is always a political winner. If you’re in a severely depressed area, you can safely be pro-development. But being against things is a lot more politically safe than being for things. Suozzi is a notable exception to this.
I think politically the role of the Islanders need to be lessened somewhat. Let’s talk about the jobs, the tax revenue, etc. that comes from the entire development. See, this is one of the reasons why you don’t just say “redevelop the Coliseum, and that’s it.” The economic impact for the entire town is relatively small. But an Edge City-type development, requiring thousands of construction jobs to build, and providing cutting-edge office space and other facilities, could be a tax gusher.
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The problem is TOH is the last bastion of old line Nassau County Republicans. Her Democratic challenger will have no chance at defeating her and the Republican machine would not tab someone else to run as long as she wants the job.
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Jack says:
Why doesn’t Wang run for Murray’s position??
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Hahaha Jack, well played. Can you imagine if Wang was in Kate Murray’s position? God knows he has the funding, and would probably have the support of the entire fanbase, and anyone with a vested interest in the NYI. I would pretty much agree this plan would pass rather quickly at that point.
When is she up for re-election?
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Dan Sec 303 says:
I don’t remember reading it, but has anyone asked Kate this question: “Supervisor, are you for the Lighthouse Project, Yes or No? Please don’t deviate from the question, are you for the project as a whole or not?” If we know if she is for it but wants to make sure the process runs its course than fine. We can understand that, with all of the legal problems with the zoning/building departments in the Town of North Hempstead. At least we would know if she is for the project or not.
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19 ISLE in NJ 22 says:
Sir William brings up good points … but many are based on his firm beliefs that ALL politicians want is a kick-back … which isn’t far off … but I think a construction project of that magnitude would present many chances for kick-backs throughout the entire process … so I don’t think if that was Kate Murray’s intention … she’d be holding up the project.
SW also has to expect some tax payer money via state grants to go towards reviews … the money is already accounted for … so that money is either going to be spent on NVMC site studies …or studying how a highway in upstate NY will affect storm water flow.
I’ve seen it time and again over the past 7 – 8 months … the State Enviro Review will take a minimum of 12-18 months … so I think we’re just getting antsy … I’d love to see someone inside the project come out and say it’s the TOH (Kate Murray) holding up the project … most of those accusations I see are our own paranoia…
Has she thrown up obstacles to the project? I think it would be a grave error for us to piss off KM by holding her accountable for things out of her control … b/c she could easily get away with telling LI Islander fans to go screw without having a big impact on her re-election campaign …. 750,000 residents in the TOH? How many registered voters?? How many really care about the LHP??
Demand a timeline, and a schedule of the progress … don’t demand her head … wait till she really has to make a decision… if you prematurely convict her … she will feel like she can’t make Isle’s fans happy anyway … so why bother trying.
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I think we need to make this a non Islanders issue for the local person that doesn’t care about hockey or the Islanders.
To me it seems that Kate Murray is not interested in growing her area. Thousands of jobs for young people and affordable housing will be the result of this project which is honestly more important to someone looking to just pay their bills.
To Nick Classic, what have you done to approach that angle? Having voters think Kate Murray isn’t out for their best interest is really the only way to get them on board.
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In light of “move to KC” environment…it got me thinking about the movie Slaphot.
Here is the cast of “Wristshot”
Bill Guerin Reggie Dunlop
Garth Snow Joe McGrath
Josh Bailey Ned Braden
Kara Guerin Francine Dunlop
Tim Jackman Dave “Killer” Carlson
Howie Rose Jim Carr
Joey MacDonald Denis Lemieux
Brendan Witt Johnny Upton
Trent Hunter Morris “Moe” Wanchuk
Chris Campoli Jean-Guy Drouin
Greg Logan Dickie Dunne
Salima Witt Shirley Upton
Sean Avery Tim “Dr. Hook” McCracken
Bruno Gervais Billy Charbois
Henrik Lundqist Tommy Hanarahan
Lundqist’s Girlfriend Suzanne Hanrahan
Kerry Fraser Final Game Referee
Colton Orr Ogie Ogilthorpe
Sam Rosen Hyannisport Announcer
Booster Club Islanders Booster Club
“Shakey” Krouse Stick Boy
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not even a cameo for CB?..LOL!
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CB can be the guy that drives the ambulance in a circle with the siren on.
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islestherapy says:
Isles316 is right on target with post #85. The average person couldn’t care less about the Islanders. But when you make it an issue of jobs and crooked politicians and the best interests of LI … then all sorts of people climb aboard, including those whose voices can reach the people who matter.
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michael says:
its an utter disgrace that kate murray is holding up the lighthouse project and putting the islanders in a position where they are threatening to move.
the project has been approved by the county. what is she waiting for? does she want a BRIBE in order to approve this deal??
i will say this much, if the islanders move i will put all my time and resources into backing any candidate running against KATE MURRAY and make sure that she never wins an elected official post again in nassau county! that i can guarantee.
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Post #87 above….I didn’t want CB to give me a timeout! lol
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What we all have to look at is that this is a lot bigger than the Islanders. This is to add jobs and help the economy for years to come and revitalize an area.
If this remains about the Islanders and Islanders only when brought up in meetings and rallies and such then it will almost for sure not happen.
We need to get people on board where the negative impact on not having the lighthouse will affect them. It’s not like the Lighthouse is only about the Islanders.
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Paul says:
Although i take what you say about Wang with a grain of salt i also understand your basically work for the man!
With that said, i feel Wang has plenty to do with what is going on as well as politics which is standard for the course.
Their is Blame to go around and Wang is No angel (CA) to use the Islanders as a Pawn to get the 100 acre project done when the Coliseum is just the Pimple on the animals back!
WHy not Start with just the coliseum?
Why? Because the whole project was designed to be built with the coliseum not just to be around it!
So now REX/WANG “WILL” redesign the plans so it works well for both……that will be the ending their, you will see! -
Mikey says:
Over 750,000 people live in ToH, but Murray won reelection in 2007 by only 36,000 votes.
http://videos.news12.com/LI_Vote2007/LIVote2007.html
A swing of 18,000 votes in the other direction could get her out office. That’s less than 3% of the population.
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MJS says:
To post #85, I think it’s more that she doesn’t care about the Islanders. Other articles have shown that she’s aware that the team exists and that’s about it. So, since she doesn’t care she doesn’t want to do anything proactive to actually streamline the approval process. It really seems to me that she thinks that this is an issue about the hockey fans on Long Island and not about the people of Long Island. When I worked out on the Island I asked a bunch of people about the project and they said that even though the traffic produced by the Lighthouse would be more unbearable they would have it in a heartbeat so they could get the fringe benefits like jobs and the expanded tax base. To that end I think Murray’s biggest crime is apathy. But you never know, maybe she know people that haven’t been suggested as subcontractors that she would like to see working on the development.
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Dan Sec 303 on Jan 16th, 2009 11:20:00 said:
“I don’t remember reading it, but has anyone asked Kate this question: “Supervisor, are you for the Lighthouse Project, Yes or No? Please don’t deviate from the question, are you for the project as a whole or not?” If we know if she is for it but wants to make sure the process runs its course than fine. We can understand that, with all of the legal problems with the zoning/building departments in the Town of North Hempstead. At least we would know if she is for the project or not.”Well FWIW she said that she supports this project and I heard it with my own ears- she said it right in front of me at the TOH meetings. So thats an answer to that question.
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I urge Isles fans to read the official Lighthouse blog (lighthouseliblog.blogspot.com)
Katrina updates it a lot and she addressed the very ideas that fans are bringing up here.
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cgs878 says:
I live in the Town of Hempstead, and I drive through the area of NVMC on a regular basis. Because of the already crappy traffic on Hempstead Turnpike, my main concern is that the Lighthouse will generate even more traffic in that area. Game nights are already unbearable, with an average of 20 minutes spent in a car idling in the parking lot, waiting to leave the site. Rush hour is much of the same.
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Traffic on Long Island is a nightmare everywhere. Shall we stop building anything because it will increase traffic? How else do you expect 18,000 people to leave an area at once? Be realistic. Every large venue has traffic congestion before and after events.
And TMC, than you for bringing up the lighthouse blog. It is a the proper source for this type of information or discussion. -
Rich says:
CB You finally realized how important today’s news is. Unfortunately, this is the exact news that we wanted to avoid. Instead of being proactive we are reactive. It takes this for us to realize how important the Islanders are to Long Island. For any of us who think Wang will keep losing money and stay please don’t be blind. We have fielded a minor league team this year. The so-called youth movement is half sham and half money freeze. The signs have been all around the team for years but nobody has noticed. I hope today they will. Take pride being a Long Islander and fight for your tradition and locale. The final straw that made me realize was when the Isles traded down twice in the past NHL draft. Although, JOsh Bailey looks good the Isles didn’t want to pay Top-5 draft pick money. So they move out of the spot and give BS about stockpiling picks. Some people defended the move. Are you people the same ones who don’t want to move Doug Weight b/c you don’t know what picks you will get in the 2nd or 3rd round? It is circular reasoning that is basic PR nonsesne, It is obvious to me and my conversation with Wang only solidified it. The Isles will move we need to do something NOW. CB I hope you can post some serious guidleines on what the fans can do to try and save the Isles. Any lifelong Long Islander whether it be man or woman has a soft spot for the team. Let us capitalize and keep Kansas City off the map where it belongs.
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When does the Islanders current lease of the Nassau Coliseum expire?
Could the Islanders legally exit from that lease prior to it expiring?
Did Garth Snow say with a straight face that scheduling the Sprint Center exhibition game is consistent with previous pre-season game scheduling? The pre-season schedule usually isn’t announced until August, let alone during a current season.
Does this mean that there will not be a pre-season game at the Nassau Coliseum prior to the beginning of the 2009-2010 National Hockey League Season?
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i’d like to see the islanders play 5 games in KC next year… is that doable? cgris? it would save isles fans money with fewer home games, give CW more and be one hell of a real threat.
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How about light rail system (similar to the JFK AirTrain) throughout the complex to service remote parking areas and all facilities? Why isn’t that part of the master plan?? That would alleviate lots of car traffic in the complex. The Lighthouse Trolley seems inadequate. Also, how much “hidden parking” will there be on-site at the Lighthouse? Maybe if they divulged EVERY little detail, we’d have a better idea of whether or not we want to support such a huge undertaking.
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David says:
CB THANK YOU! Thank you for pointing out that Wang DOES care about the team and that it would be ignorant to think otherwise. That is the point I was trying to make with my question in yesterdays blog. Maybe we can now move on to the real problem and stop with the Wang bashing.
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Please do not feel sorry for Charles Wang either. Although he is losing money on the team this is not uncommon. There are a bunch of pro sports teams that lose money or break even each year. These losses are usually covered by the rich owner’s huge profit in other areas of business. Wang makes a ton of money on Long Island and the Islanders are his toy. Wang is very rich and the project will make him richer. It is a win win situation for Long Island.
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94 Mikey on Jan 16th, 2009 12:10:08 said:
Over 750,000 people live in ToH, but Murray won reelection in 2007 by only 36,000 votes. A swing of 18,000 votes in the other direction could get her out office. That’s less than 3% of the population.Mikey … thanks for the info … I kinda looked it up myself … and the way you present it makes it look like a slight bump the other way in voter choice and Murray’s a gonner …. well that is just totally deceiving … here is the reality from News 12′s Vote 2007 page ….
Kate Murray* (R-I-C) 66,043 68% (X)
Kevin Gorman (D) 30,729 32%Sure she only won by 36,000 votes … but you neglected to mention that the oppnent only got 30k+ votes …. in election terms she not only won by a land slide … she wiped the floor with him … she won with more than 2/3 of the vote …. to put it in US Senate terms … she’d be fillibuster proof.
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Marc from Troy says:
To mrlbem (80), re: “The problem is TOH is the last bastion of old line Nassau County Republicans. Her Democratic challenger will have no chance at defeating her”… Well, maybe you haven’t noticed, but absolutes like that in politics are not exactly what they used to be. Whether caused by the widespread dissatisfaction w/Pres. Bush and the national GOP or not, Republicans are no longer being re-elected just because they are Republicans, regardless of location. This sort of thing is playing out all over the country, and, if anything, it’s the exact opposite of what you suggest: there are many instances of Democrats winning previously long-time Republican offices just because they’re NOT Republicans! This is happening not only here in NYS, but also nationally. Look it up. So to think that it couldn’t happen in Hempstead is simply ignoring the current political climate.
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Also, to Nick Classic… Re: what can be done to help move this thing along… Objectively speaking, there are many different groups who should be very much interested in seeing this project to fruition. Curious if you (or anyone else) has reached out to two of them, in particular: construction unions (for obvious reasons) and not-for-profit organizations who are at least partially dependent upon charitable contributions from the Islanders (whose charitable works are not insignificant). I would think those would be some very loud voices should they decide to be heard on this subject.
And I’m not on the Island, so I couldn’t be on the front lines, but would certainly be interested in doing what I could to help out even a little bit. (Although wife and I are coming down for the March 7-8 weekend games, should there be anything going on by then.) This project IS that important to the future of our team.
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Let’s just say I’ve collected business cards and made use of them, Marc. Your thinking is right on.
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BringBackNyles says:
Guys, DO NOT EMAIL HER
Politicians don’t read email, interns/flacks/aids read email.
Call her office. Speak to her or her asiistant..provide your address and tell her your a voter. When she shows up to salute a high school band, or open little league, or greet shoppers, or holds a public forum..hold her feet to the fire. Ask her the question in front of other voters.
Make her public life all abut answering the islanders, thats how things get noticed.
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Rich, you are completely off base with your assumption the Isles don’t want to pay.
There is a salary cap floor that every team needs to be at so they can’t cut costs.
Doug Weight salary with incentives is over 4 million. comrie was resigned for 4 million.
Those are signs of the complete opposite.
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Last comment in the old thread, which won;t be read, so here goes again:
1. Why are people angry at Wang for wanting to make money off of the land? As I’ve said here before, let’s say the Lighthouse does not get approved, even if the area will remain dormant for a few years (like the Roosevelt Raceway property did), something will eventually be built there and someone will make a lot of money off of what is eventually built. The person making that money may as well be Charles Wang because it will benefit the team.
Point 2–It’s all well and good for Ms. Murray to refer to the ongoing environmental review, but as CB mentioned several weeks ago, she could at least be touting the benefits of the project for her constituency. Whenever Tom Suozzi or Howard Weitzman, the Nassau County Comptroller, talk of the future of Nassau County, they mention the need for the Lighthouse Project and the benefits it would bring to the County. Why is Murray not saying the same things when she talks about the TOH’s future? What is the ulterior motive here?