TIME FOR LIGHTHOUSE TO CHANGE ITS TUNE
Hempstead without a clue; “Meet Me” where?
The frontrunner at the All-Star break for most constructive reader Comment of the Year was a throw-away line in the middle of a long sermon. It was Comment No. 56 after the story on Kevin Gorman, the Democratic nominee for Town of Hempstead Supervisor in 2007.
Nick Classic, an Islanders fan who has dedicated a big portion of his spare time to the Lighthouse cause, had this little piece of gold in his 100-word Comment.
“I don’t think the ‘Meet Me at the Lighthouse” commercial most accurately conveys their message.”
By Nick, I’ve think you’ve got it!
If you’ve been to an Islanders game or have cable television, you’ve seen the “Meet Me at the Lighthouse” ad. (Here’s one version). Although the singer gets so over-heated he sounds like the faux rocker in the “Real Men of Genius” spots, it’s a catchy, effective tune. It accompanies exciting visuals of really good looking people having the time of their lives shopping, drinking, eating and cheering at this mythical spot called the Lighthouse at Long Island. I’m telling you, the place looks amazing!
It’s like saying “Meet Me at Foxwoods.” Except for the minor detail that Foxwoods, you know, actually exists.
The “Meet Me at the Lighthouse” jingle, like Clay, Ruben and Taylor, had its run. But now the message has run its course. The message needs to change. It’s time to get tougher.
It’s gotten to the point where if the Lighthouse developers have to play dirty like a politician, they should go for it. Here’s one: compare the economics of the Lighthouse deal to the public pillaging by the Yankees.
All Charles Wang and Scott Rechler want to do is pave a parking lot and put up paradise. Yet our “community leaders” want to test their patience. The geniuses at the Town of Hempstead made another big push-back in Newsday today. But this time they brought to the table something different…oh, no that’s wrong. They’re still trying to sell the scam that Wang and Rechler should “rapidly” procede with renovating the Coliseum. It’s official: the leaders of the Town of Hempstead are in over their heads.
This isn’t the time for happy tunes. Metallica is playing the barn next week. Maybe the Lighthouse can commission some angry speed metal from Hetfield and the boys.
Nick Classic is right about “Meet Me at the Lighthouse.” There’s no point in a shiny, hopeful diddy about Oz when there isn’t even a shovel in the ground. We’re not in Kansas City yet, Toto.
Build the frickin’ Lighthouse
Oh, it’s been a long, long while
Build the frickin’ Lighthouse
Or it’s time to get off this isle
Comments.
186 Responses to “TIME FOR LIGHTHOUSE TO CHANGE ITS TUNE
Hempstead without a clue; “Meet Me” where?”
Please Wait
I never looked at Metallica as being the ones to lead a call to action for anything other than another round at the bar… but you have a point.
CB do u think Wang may compromise a litle more with the ToH. The artilce seems to convey that they think its to big. Would Wang scale it down to make the lighthouse somewhat happen
Totally agree with that. Time to get a tougher song, a tougher GM, and a tougher team. Time to get TOUGH.
You are 100% correct about TOH being in over their heads. This is not a good sign. They keep repeating the same lines about just renovating and obviously it’s to get the non hockey fans on their side by making Wang and Co. look greddy. Also I like in the article how it says they got about 80 emails???? Something tells me it was a lot more but they wouldn’t say that to the public. If this team leaves a big part of me would die with this franchise. I want to be able to bring my 9 month old son to many games down the road and share my tradition with him. unfortunately if these hacks in office keep this up sadly I’ll never get the chance.
You’re right. Change the ad campaign t something that resembles a political campaign. Dish out facts like: 1. the Lighthouse Project will lead to the creation of X jobs. 2. The Lighthouse Project will lead to an additional X dollars of tax revenue to the [County, TOH, surrounding villages]. 3. The County supports this project and has given the developers the go ahead. And so on and so on. Get the facts out.
Well, it’s pretty clear where I stand on this one - so I’ll keep my mouth shut. Thanks for the piece, CB. I always wondered why such a vital project for Long Island’s future was promoted by a vague commercial with no real information loaded with stock footage.
kate murray is the best community organizer since sarah palin..
Assuming for a moment the team opts to relocate. When is the earliest they could do so? Don’t get me wrong, I’d never want to seem them go. All I am saying is that there is no sense of urgency on either side. Without that, there will be no progress. The two are still so far apart that it doesn’t seem as if any plan will be approved in the foreseeable future. Wang needs to take a hard line stance and start making things happen than taking the BS passive approach that’s getting him nowhere fast.
“It’s official: the leaders of the Town of Hempstead are in over their heads.”
Based on the responses and interviews I have read that is exactly what this is: personnel and politicians who are shortsighted, unmotivated, and just incapable of handling a project of this scope and size.
We need a Robert Moses, not a “stick in the mud” Kate Murray.
FYI lol the faux rocker you speak of in the real men of genius commercials is not faux at all actually. It’s the lead singer of the band Survivor! :).
But anyway, my question is despite all the posturing my deep down feeling is that it eventually gets done because it NEEDS to. How do you feel Chris?
I think it’s time, we as residents and Fans, change angles as well. We need to leave the Isles out of it and bring up points that make the Lighthouse vital to Long Island. A sports technology facility may bring in co.’s with names like Nike, Reebok, Bauer, etc. A hotel will allow for more conventions, which are currently being hosted in NYC and Boston. A well maintained landscape will bring families in to stroll and spend money at the local shops. Office space will keep Long Islanders on Long Island, rather than travelling into NYC or beyond. I can go on and on. The Islanders and Coliseum are only a fraction of what the Lighthouse will provide. It’s time we reach out to the pols and tell them we want this, not because it’s imperative for our team but that it’s imperative for Long Islanders.
This is out of left field, but is there anything in NY State (or U.S.) law (constitutional or otherwise) that would allow Nassau County to “annex” the NVMC property? That is, remove it from the jurisdictional authority of the Town of Hempstead?
I’ve said this before, but many of the people on Long Island who are against the Lighthouse don’t get it. I am almost 28 years old, a hard working carpenter, college educated, ambitious enough to try to start my own business. Long Island needs people like me. But, I live in New Orleans, not LI, and mostly because of 2 things: 1) Long Island is growing stagnant and is starting to decline. New Orleans is in the opposite possition (lively and on it’s way up after being destroyed) 2) It is flat out too damned expensive to live on Long Island for a 20-something with student loans, etc, and people my age are leaving in droves. If you would like to continue this trend, then prevent the Lighthouse and other ambitious projects from happening, and watch as LI fades away into oblivion. If you would like to reverse this reputation, then take bold steps and don’t be afraid to step on peoples toes.
Mark, good point. What’s interesting is that when Arizona was pushing the whole complex in Glendale, including the stadium that is going to host the Super Bowl this week, the one name you never heard was “Bidwill.” He was pretty well despised.
Now, I’m not saying that Wang is like that, nor the Islanders. But all this talk of “We have to build the Lighthouse because we have to keep the Islanders!” doesn’t mean a damn thing to somebody who couldn’t care less about hockey or sports. I’m not saying the Isles should be out of the marketing campaign completely, but it’s not enough. We need jobs now and in the future. The Lighthouse will bring them. Focus in on that.
Besides, anybody in marketing or advertising will tell you a message can get stale after awhile.
That is funny, I just said this the other day, they keep airing that great commercial..”come to the Lighthouse..” and they show all sorts of things goin on couples being romantic, and the place looks amazing! the stores..the whole nine yards, they tell you to bring your smile and yet? it’s not even there?? I mean if the project was in full swing? I could totally see that being aired, but it’s not, it may be the intentions of what’s to come, but stop telling us to come to a place that’s not even built.
And please do something before Wang packs up and says enough! and takes the team with him!..stop with the tit for tat.. uh? can I say that on here? you know what they say?..if you build it..they will come. Actually we need more then a new arena to boost this teams contending chances but they need to stay here on the Island where they belong!
I have a question for anyone in the know. Every time the Lighthouse comes up, people talk about the corrupt gov. Why haven’t we done anything about it yet? It’s about time we stop allowing the corruption and stand up for ourselves.
Screw the Old people that don’t want the Island to change. I feel for DanNOLA post #13. I was in the same spot and am in a worse spot now because I bought a home on LI. I’m sick of the corruption thats being talked about and know that we have a voice. Let’s put it to use.
I dont think it is as Cut and Dry as a Commercial, their is more to it. Look Murray is going in deeper becuase she knows Wangs playing a Game and let the Games Begin.
What troubles me is the Fact Wang has had Approval for the Coliseum for Years now and Yet we Went from Needing a Building(coliseum) in 2001-2002, then Wang went to the Nassau HUB 2003-2004, and Now we have the Lighthouse! Iknow! Iknow! the Islanders Cant exist without the WHOLE Project being built which i feel is BS! And anyway did WANG ever once say he would Sink money into the Islanders after the project was done (publically) or we all just Asume that or will he even be around! Some should read Neil Best’s article today in newsday. The Isle’s aren’t going anywhere Mark my Words!! And i am for the Project to let you all know!
Was any land use proposal submitted during the bidding for the area limited to just the coliseum?
We will get the Lighthouse somehow. I agree we need it badly. Long Island is missing the boat on this one. The lighthouse will really help the economy on long island.
We could always bring Disturbed in to the mix. “Get Down with The Lighthouse” Oooo ah ah ah! In all seriousness, when are these people at TOH going to approve my “low-income” housing. I’ve been dying to get out of my parent’s house and move closer to the team I love so much! LOL
Blitz: No. And Paul, there’s your answer to your suggestion that the idea that a Coliseum-only proposal is “BS.”
Not a single company, during the county RFP, bid a Coliseum-only renovation. If that’s such a great project, and could have gotten done without a full scale review by the town, why didn’t anybody bid it?
As far as Neil Best’s article: yes, the Islanders have a really nice TV deal here. But if they could go to Kansas City rent-free — which is what was offered to the Penguins — it would offset the lost TV revenue. Neil Best said an Islanders move would be bad for MSG network. It didn’t say it would be bad for the Islanders. Please read carefully, Paul.
Notice how almost no opponents of the Lighthouse offer well-written, cogent arguments here? Just a lot of ranting, lots of capital letters, lots of exclamation points.
Mr. Negative here again LOL I would like to see something done at the NVMC site yes. The Lighthouse as a whole NO. Dont want to rehash here but there are many new NHL buildings with not much around. Places like Philly Minnesota Colorado San Jose etc. All have profitible NHL franchises without the lighthouse. I live 5-10 min. from NVMC I really Dont want to stare at 2 400 foot high buildings here in the suburbs everyday. The majority of Long Islanders and Islander fans alike agree with me. Yes do something with the property make it nice but we are stuffing 10 pounds of you know what in a 5 pound bag here. It is just way too much. As far as Wang goes I do not and can not trust this man. The way he runs his sports franchise and the way he tells people it is my team I will do what I want scares me. Show me CW that you can and will turn the Isles back into a proud franchise and maybe I would be on board more the I am but after 10 years of broken promisis of a team we can be proud of and the fact that my beloved Islanders have been reduced to a circus is unforgiveable!!
Have they marketed in alternative energy or environmental aspects of this. It have my vote 100% Long Island could use the convention center and 5 star hotel to lure in more visitors which mean more revenue and tax dollars for Nassau County and its merchants.. Think how great it could be to have the NHL allstar game here in a few years…
DanNOLA, I think that Kate Murray should hear your story. You exemplify why this project is needed on Long Island!
Aim on Jan 23rd, 2009 12:01:46 said:
“…I would like to see something done at the NVMC site yes. The Lighthouse as a whole NO…”
Nassau County disagrees with you… they are the ones that wanted and voted overwhelmingly for a project of this magnitude.
JayK - That was my point. The County NEVER received a coliseum only option. Each proposal was for a complete redevelopment of the land beyond the Coliseum. TOH had no say during the RFP.
TOH, while they have the zoning rights, is playing coy and misleading the public by saying a ‘Coliseum only’ deali is what Wang & Co. could have done a lot earlier.
I have said this previously on here, but, IMO, TOH is above their heads on this thing. Their best option is try to push back rather than get steamrolled.
Paul*
The reason the need gets greater each year, from just the Coli in ‘01 to the current state, is that Wang has lost Millions. While I don’t believe it’s as high as some have mentioned, he still has lost tons. Now, I’ve met Mr. Wang on several occassions and he is, no doubt, a Long Islander. But he is also a businessman. While Wang will not be the one to move the team, he will not keep a sinking ship either. The current need for the whole project helps him recoup some of those losses that have accumulated over the last 8-9 years. In addition, as I mentioned, he is a LI’er and sees what this project will bring to Long Island. Jobs, entertainment, $$$.
Gread read CB and you are 100% correct. Most people that are casual hockey fans (such as my boss) had no idea what the ad was for. He thought it was for an actual Lighthouse. The entire ad campaign is very very weak.
AIM - the teams you identify have arenas in downtown city locations. LI does not have a city or city center. Adding other items to the pie is what makes the area more attractive than the building itself. Sadly, the lighthouse is actually a planned suburban development something LI seriously lacks. I guess turning houses in tinting shops, tax offices, bakeries, etc. like the rest of Hempstead Tpk is ‘attractive.’
ANA has a stand alone building, but it is within vicinity of Angels Stadium, and Disneyland, Anaheim convention center, etc.
FL has a stand alone building that is 30 miles west of ocean, in the middle of nowhere, and ’shares’ a parking lot with a giant outlet mall. How attractive…
Otter - Post #8 - The Questions is when could they move? Lets hope NEVER!!!
In reality what is scary is that with the arena all ready to go in KC - They could potentially pull a Colts!! Thats very scary!
I think Wang would give us warning first though - I think towards the end of the season he will play a harder card - Build or Im Selling! Thoughts?
Mark post #11 is right on as well
Good post, CB. I don’t even live there, but that commercial makes me cringe every time I see it.
Several good comments already made here (in particular, #s 5,9,11,13,14 & 16). You guys get it, and I hope that eventually the powers-that-be will, as well. The message needs to change, and it needs to change quickly.
AIM: You are forgetting some key differences:
–You can get to the Wachovia Center in Philadelphia by mass transit, so you can enjoy dinner or beers downtown before or after the game. That is an enormous difference.
–Ditto Denver’s Pepsi Center.
–The Xcel Center in St. Paul is right in the middle of downtown. There is no comparison to the Coliseum site.
–San Jose is on a light rail system, and it is in downtown San Jose.
None of the four arenas you noted are in the same sort of situation as the Coliseum site.
Will you people just accept that there’s not going to be a stand-alone Coliseum? I know it’s nice to wrap yourself up in conspiracy theories about corrupt politicans and greedy businessman, but saying nothing should ever get built because of corrupt politicans/greedy businessmen is a surefire way of watching your region rot.
And blitz…Florida has a terrible attendance problem as a result.
if you think 10 miles from the coliseum is the suburbs my man, you really should take a trip off of that place sometimes…that area where the building and marriott are on is a dump, and it could use a revitalization. however, in this economy its simply not happening. seriously how could the town really undertake a project like this right now. you know how many island residents that work in finance got canned or no bonus this year. im talking folks that made in the millions. that tax revenue for the county is gone. this fact will cripple the existing nassau county budget. theres no way they can get behind a real estate project in this environment…
Anaheims building is within walking distance of shops and restaurants. I was out there 5 years ago so I only imagine there is more out there now.
Would someone please clarify one point for me. Based on various things I’ve read, it appears that no approval can be granted by the TOH until the environmental feasibility study is complete, which is not going to be until this spring (partly due to the developers delay in submitting their full plans). What exactly should the TOH be doing right now to move this along that they are not doing? With this information, we can all put more specific requests in letters and emails to them.
Unrelated to the Lighthouse topic.
CB, any clue on whether or not the Isles ever considered picking up Cory Murphy off of waivers? I’m not saying is he better than what we have, nor would he add any size to our lineup, but he has been impressive for two games in Tampa (3 pts, 20+ minutes/game). It seems to me that he potentially could have fit into our system, bringing a somewhat similar skillset as Streit.
Post # 22 just to let you know in Philadelphia they are knocking down the old building to do exactly what Wang is trying to do here. And you also can’t compare the others because you don’t know who owns the buildings and what the leases are like.
CB,
Obviously it’s clear that the Town of Hempstead does not want the full Light House Project and all of it’s elements.
Is there anyway that Wang And Rechler would scale it does just a little bit? They could still have shops and stores but do we really need a minor league baseball field?
bomber - learn economics. you build during a distressed economy to provide jobs, eventually the cycle will run its course and the rest of society will be ready to rock/roll when the project is completed.
Bomber, I’m sorry, but your post is just stupid. This project is not being paid for by the town or the county. It’s just a rant. It adds nothing to the discussion.
Again: I’m waiting for the first anti-Lighthouse project that is something more than “Oh, we can’t do this here…too big..corrupt politicians..economy stinks.” Can’t you people come up with anything?
I have been a NY Islander’s fan since 1973, while in college in Fla. I began reading about this “New” hockey team from NY, yes NY, I’m sure many of the NHL teams that if given the chance to move their NHL team to Long Island, NY they would do it in a heart beat, and be thrilled to do so. The NY Islander’s with the Lighthouse Project, and a Quality Hockey Team, with John Tavares leading the way, have all the potential in the world. All NY Islander’s fan’s want, is a Quality Hockey Team, and Stability amoung the Ranks. It is such Crime, that an organization that from 1972, through 1993 brought Long Island NY, so much “Excitment”, and $$$$$$$$$MONEY$$$$$$$$$ to the area. You talk about a well kept secret, there is a huge one sitting in Long Island, NY, called the NY Islander’s. The NY Islander’s, The NY Islander’s Fan’s and the People of Long Island, NY need and deserve this to happen. I don’t think people realize the potential of this Franchise. So much of the incredible passion, NY Islander’s fan’s have, AND many NY Islander’s fan’s that unfortunatly now call themselves NJ Devil’s fan’s, simple because the organization basically from 1995 until Mr. Charles Wang bought the Team, left them out to dry! I do believe many Devil fan’s would quickly resolitify their allegence to the NY Islander’s. “NEW YORK” do they (These people holding this project up) relize the Honor and what it means, being a Team from New York. One of the Greatest Rivalry’s in the world exist here. A Rivalry that has survived basically a 15 year reign of disaster. Please let me know what I can do to help Chris, you know You, and the NY Islander, can count on me. Thanks again Chris, Mark from NJ
I think what is being lost in all of this is that the project is actually proceeding through the SEQR process, which took years to even start and which can probably take years to complete for a project of this magnitute. Along those lines, we should be grateful that someone cleared the site of what ever bilogical resources were there and paved it over, leaving any development to worry more about physical resources (e.g., air quality), socioeconomic effects, and infrastructure (utilities, emergency response, traffic/transportation).
I prepare documents for compliance with the same type of process for a living, but for the federal government instead of the state. I can tell you that a project of this size takes time to get through a process like this, and the way it is being handled (lots of public involvement during scoping, piecemealing the document into TOH so they can provide early feedback) is actually expediting the process.
And ultimately, in the end, the resultant report is simply a disclosure document that qualifies, and to whatever extent possible quantifies, the potential effects. Even in circumstances where those effects might be significant, it does not mean the project is dead in the water. A report like this really just allows the public the opportunity to understand what is coming down the pike and give them the chance to comment on the proposal elements and their potential effects.
It has been a while since I looked at the laws related to the SEQR process, but if it is at all similar to the federal process, simple votes of “I hate this project” will do nothing to stop it in its track. Summing things up very generally, the way it works with the feds, the response to a report like this can hold up the project only if people submit claims that 1) the process was not followed to the “T”, or 2) they question the data/analysis in the document based on other factual information.
In short - I think everyone should recognize that this project is likely to get done, but we all need more of those hated “P” and “H” words - patience for the SEQR process to be completed, and hope that it was done right.
Sorry, way over my limits in terms of number of words, but hopefully I’ll be excused.
Re: #12
According to a recent Supreme Court decision, Nassau County can use eminent domain to wrest jurisdiction from the ToH and defend themselves effectively if they have a good lawyer. A compelling case can be made for economic reform and the unacceptable current state of the land around the Coliseum. If you can prove that it’ll bring jobs in the current economy and stop the brain drain–thereby leading to a massive public benefit–I believe that the taking will stand under the “public use” exemption in the Takings Clause of the U.S. Constitution.
However, I am not an expert on that particular area of law. Additionally, it would be an extreme move and would breed enmity between the Town and County.
40 CT Isles Fan on Jan 23rd, 2009 12:27:14 said:
“CB,
Obviously it’s clear that the Town of Hempstead does not want the full Light House Project and all of it’s elements.
Is there anyway that Wang And Rechler would scale it does just a little bit? They could still have shops and stores but do we really need a minor league baseball field?”
They certainly arent going to get rid of things like that- those are the things that will help them environmentally. Using land to make parks is a GOOD thing. It is a positive part of the environmental impact, so why would they delete things like that when the environmental impact is such a huge part of all of this???
But Ill say this again- this proposal as it stands right now, the whole shebang, proposal is what Nassau County wanted. If they didnt want all those things, they would not have picked this proposal in the first place. They could have modified this by taking those kinds of things out (like they did with the lighthouse tower) but they didnt do that. Or, they could have picked one of the many other proposals- but they didnt do that either. This project is what Nassau county wants.
It is a shame that a bunch of political hacks have such a large say in this process. Nassau County obviously gets it, but the TOH, not so much. It’s like having our own little band of Sheldon Silvers running around (for those who don’t know, he essentially singlehandedly squashed NYC’s olympic bid and the West Side stadium for the Jets) and that does not inspire confidence. I still believe this project gets done eventually, but we all need to keep the pressure on Murray and her incompitent gang of political cronies.
D-Money: great post.
And I wanna add one more thing: a similar use of eminent domain is allowing for a similar rebuild of similarly dumpy areas in Willets Point around CitiField (lots of similarities hehe). So this is not without precedent at all– it’s just that the ToH has primary jurisdiction because the area is completely within its borders.
The difference between this and the Jets stadium is that it is not a reach to imagine that area developing as a solid residential area over the next 10-20 years.
What happens to the Coliseum site without the Lighthouse? I shudder to think. We had an opportunity to put something really visionary on the old Roosevelt Raceway site, and what do we have? Ever try walking anywhere around there?
I also think TOH has jurisdiction because the stepped up and became the lead agency on the SEQR process. Again, the specifics are kinda fuzzy about how/why that happened, and makes me wonder why the county did not take the lead…
Nick, you have any insight on that?
Thanks for the SEQR analysis D-Money (post 44). It is important for us to understand that the officials and developers need to follow the SEQR process in order to prevent any lawsuits down the line.
However, I think everyone is really worried because the signals coming from Kate Murray and her office are DISTURBING. She never says anything positive regarding the project, and her recent talk of protecting the “suburban tranquility” of an asphalt wasteland appears to be a blatant pander to the few NIMBY’s who oppose this project.
I think we need to ask two things from Murray: 1) What is your opinion of the Lighthouse project? and 2) What is the timeline for this project - i.e. finalizing the environmental review and scheduling public hearings.
Nick - #30,
Like I said, I’d prefer they never left. Although the objective from a business perspective is for the team to make money, which they have not. The only leverage Wang has is to threaten a move or sell. It wouldn’t even be a threat, but a reality. Can’t imagine he wants to hold onto a struggling franchise if there is no money to be made. Do you honestly think that he purchased the team without first thinking that there was a prime opportunity to expand and make it a worthwhile investment? That being said, the redevelopment and expansion of the coliseum is his only real opportunity to regain back any of the money he’s laid out over the years. Otherwise, it will continue to be a financial drain and not worth holding onto.
#37: The developer’s delays you cite were created in the first place by the ToH, which took forever to finish the scoping.
#46: The county can’t use eminent domain to change the jurisdiction. They already own the land, having bought it from the army in ‘61.
The county probably didn’t declare themselves the lead because they own the land and approved the project, and would have been susceptible to accusations (in a tenuous political season) that they were pushing a big-money project through with no review. With Wang and Rechler’s deep Republican contacts, I don’t imagine they ever thought the ToH would be such a roadblock.
I think I read somewhere that the Islanders’ current NVMC lease ends in 2015, but I’m sure that they could move sooner than that if there’s an “early termination fee” that can be paid. The Newsday article says that the Lighthouse project would take 8-10 years to complete! Ouch, that’s a long time. Add to that the inevitable cost overruns and delays and maybe it’ll be done by 2025 or so.
Some kind of light rail system between the Lighthouse and Roosevelt Field would be a nice addition. Light rail between the Lighthouse and the Mineola LIRR train station would be nice too. It’s too bad that these were not included as options (or considerations).
Agreed Mikey, and ultimately, it is the lead agency (TOH) who must sign-off on the decision to approve, or not approve, so her personal feelings certainly have the opportunity to derail this thing, but IMO, they must be supported by the analysis in the EIS.
Blackwasser (#9) “We need a Robert Moses, not a “stick in the mud” Kate Murray”
Careful what you wish for. Robert Moses was instrumental in the Dodgers moving from Brooklyn to Los Angeles.
Cb can you explain what the possible motivation is for the town of hempstead not to push the lighthouse project through??
I just dont get it.
1.The project would mean tons of tax dollars and jobs for the town of hempstead.
2.Charles wang and the rest of his group are gonna finance most of the lighthouse so its not like the town has to pay a ton.
3. The area where they want to build is crap right now. Would,nt they want to upgrade?
4.Not pushing this through could mean the end of the isles on long island. Do they really want that??
5. This would put hempstead on the map. More money, more people and an actual place for people to go. (Besides roosevelt field).
I DON”T GET IT. whats the downside for them?
Does the TOH have an alternative vision for the property aside from a gigantic parking lot featuring a decaying vacant facility?
To me, by far the most disturbing thing about this whole process is Murray’s refusal to take a position. Do you support the project or don’t you. Let the voters know your position so that they can decide your political future accordingly. Simply put, Murray needs to grow a spine. Take a position, and let the chips fall where they may. Even if people disagree with you, at least they will respect the fact that you actually let them know where you stand.
Here’s the downside:
Full disclosure: I am a Republican, though the Nassau County GOP is making that increasingly difficult, as a party with absolutely no vision at all.
The roots of the Nassau County Republican Party come out of those many people who moved from Queens, Brooklyn, the Bronx into this area starting in the 1950’s. The GOP often raised the specter of Long Island becoming like “the city” whenever it was politically helpful.
Kate Murray is the latest example of this.
But not being “the city” is not a vision. It doesn’t say how we’re going to keep young people from moving elsewhere. It doesn’t say how we’re going to retain businesses who are already here who can’t build their employee work force because of the brain drain. It doesn’t say how you become a region of cutting edge economic activity when you are losing population. (The correlation between dying economies and population loss is almost a perfect 1, I’m sure, and Nassau County lost population in the last decade. Strong economies do not lose population).
It’s a philosophy that assumes that a 24-year-old today wants the same thing as their GRANDparents — not parents — wanted 40 years ago: to get away from the city. They are utterly clueless in noting that young people are moving back to the city, not away from it.
But “we’re not the city” is very popular at the ballot box for those who’ve stuck around. To me, the idea that this development over a few hundred acres makes us “the city” is utterly ridiculous.
But in Hempstead in particular, it has long worked at the polls for the Republicans.
Just resonding to some of the follow up posts to my last #22. Yes the buildings mentioned are in cities like Philly and Denver etc. Minny is in St. Paul and the rink is basiclly in the middle of nowhere. Awesome building though. My point with each of these cities is that the owners of the hockey teams make a nice profit as a stand alone entity. They do not benefit financially from anything around the arena other then the fact is that it could help draw people. By putting a good tream on the ice the people come anyway. The lease here is horrible and a big deterant to making money no doubt. CW could have bought out SMG years ago and got total crontol of the building parking concessions and events. He declined to spend the money. I agree we do need something here. Jay post 33 & blitz 29 I agree with you but scale the thing down a bit it is just too much IMHO. Chris #25 yea the county said yes but it is the TOH that has to approve everything The county approval means zip without the TOH. And my last point CW has a good partner in Rexcorp. But do you see who runs the Lighthouse Corp?? Mike Picker and Paul Lancey. These are 2 CA executives from years past. As a TOH resident I do not want to have CW and his crazy ideas of sumo goalies and circus like management qualities operating a project we are all going to have to live with for the rest of our lives. CW bought a boatload of property in Oyster Bay that stll sits dormant today cause he wanted to do a smaller similar project up there. Oyster Bay said NO! Lets get on the TOB about rejecting CW and his idea. My point this is not just about hockey there are many issues to go with it. If there was no arena involved would we really care if the lighthouse project got approved?
Otto - I agree with you 100% - thats why i expect the threats to get a bit more clear as this drags on!
Blackwasser - Tim is right - It can be argued that Moses was the reason the Dodgers left and he didnt want City folk going out the Island - im not sure this would be a project he would like
Great article and comments on this very important topic.I keep coming back to one thing at this point.
We’ve heard from Tom Suozzi, from Kate Murray and from other elected officials. We’ve heard from everyone except Charles Wang at this point, and even in the Newsday article it said he couldn’t be reached for comment.
Whether he has the ball in his court or not right now with the project , at this point I want to hear SOMETHING from Wang. I’m sure at the very least he (or his people) can draft a statement to his fans. His silence amidst all of this noise is starting to bug me out.
I would care even if the team wasn’t involved. These sorts of new urban developments are being embraced by residents and business alike. In particular, older residents are tired of facing two alternatives as their kids leave: stay in a house far bigger than they need, or move into some senior citizen development like you find out in Ridge. I’m going to be an empty nester in 8-10 years, and I don’t want to be in a four bedroom house. Neither do I want to be in friggin’ Ridge or someplace like that. I want to be in the center of it all. But the current housing configuration on Long Island makes that very difficult. I would move to a place like The Lighthouse in a second.
Willis #64 - If I were Wang I wouldn’t say a word either. He stirred up the hornet’s nest with the KC game, and now the ball is squarely in TOH’s court. Comments like the ones in today’s Newdsday are pure posturing, and they don’t address the fact that the Lighthouse project is still in their inbox.
Re: Aim (62)… “If there was no arena involved would we really care if the lighthouse project got approved?”
You should.
In any kind of economy, much less the one we’re living with today, jobs and tax revenue do not just appear out of nowhere. If their outdated vision of suburbia is more important to the NIMBY’s than things like new jobs, increased tax revenue, and the growth and retention of local businesses and population, then you might as well just settle in and look forward to many years of increased property taxes and reduced services.
If you’re using things like the ridiculous “sumo goalies” comment (still bringing that up? really?) to support your argument even a little bit, you are badly out of touch. Get over silly old crap like that and wake up to what’s actual reality today.
Lets face it guys we are never going to see the Lighthouse Project completed. Sad but true. I just hope the Islanders don’t move to KC that would be a travesty
#61 Jayk - Well put. They are so out of touch it’s embarrassing.
Long Islanders are moving off the Island in droves as they can’t afford it. A place to live and work thats affordable seems like a good idea to me.
Who and where are the business leaders of today’s Long Island? And community leaders. And I don’t mean D’Amato & Co. Aren’t there any well known, influential/high profile heavyweights that care? Isn’t there anyone like that, willing to take an active interest in this and help with some kind of PR campaign to mobilize support for this project? There needs to a united front of high visibility, high energy voices and faces on the RIGHT side of this issue. And soon. It would help a great deal.
You’re all being scammed by Wang. His ownership of the Islanders has been an unmitigated failure and disaster. He cares nothing for the team. He bought the team for the sole ulterior motive so as to use them as a pawn to overdevelop the property surrounding the Coliseum. Contrary to the comparison to Yankee Stadium or Citi Field-those projects ONLY related to a STADIUM-not a project which is a ridiculous over development of a critical area. The truth is that if Wang wasn’t so greedy and arrogant he could probably make a deal that works but his style is always his way or the highway. The sad part about all this is that if he actually tried and succeeded with getting a truly competitive team on the ice in his almost decade of ownership, he would have gotten the public support he needs for the project he wants. Instead he has destroyed most of the Islanders loyal fan base to the point that most people now do not care if the team moves.
D$ - yes, the Town of Hempstead is lead agency on the Lighthouse project, and they’ve issued the positive declaration (for non environmental people, that just means something new is being built so there will be some environmental impact). However, the reason they control this is because they have to re-zone the land around the Coliseum in order to accommodate the development. That’s why my petition is entitled “Approve the Lighthouse Re-zoning Application.”
Thanks to all those fans who get it. This is a key project for the future of Long Island in so many ways beyond keeping our Islanders where they belong. I especially empathize with you, DanNOLA (great town by the way…think of me next time you’re at Mother’s or Cafe Du Monde). I’m in the process of founding a business catered to high technology. There is no support structure for me to found the business out here, so I’ll either be going to the city or out to Silicon Valley. Let’s disregard whether or not I want to leave this area, because, like you, the decision was made for me a long time ago. We crow and pat ourselves on the back about what a great place Long Island is to raise children, but those children get the hell out of Dodge as soon as they can for the most part. From my perspective, I feel that young, single people like myself aren’t welcome here, and there is no support structure to allow me to live my dreams on Long Island. This is an absolutely necessary project on so many levels.
I moved this to the bottom for emphasis - D$ is also dead right on the SEQR process so far. Everything I know about the process I know from him calling the DEC and forwarding the information he got. The environmental review is proceeding nicely, and it should be done within 2 months. That part is not avoidable, but the saber-rattling and coded language is very avoidable, as well as unfortunate.
Marc In all due respect do you live in Troy or is that just a screen name. For the past 25 years the NYI have been a part of my every day life. Yes I will wake up and look at TODAY. REALITY TODAY is that I keep pouring thousands of dollars a season into my habit known as the NYI. For those thousands of dollars I get to see a team that would struggle to compete in the AHL. I have seen an owner tell me as a season ticket holder that he will do whatever it takes to win. He made the statement that he will spend whatever it takes to build a winner. In his 10 years as owner he has failed us miserbly!! We got rid of coaches like Ted and Pete. Why?? We got rid of Neil Smith why?? We had a team being run by a committe of people. When told that dont work in the NHL our owner stated he runs things HIS was. 2 years ago we had a team that had 92 points. Today our team is a gutted shell. Newsday pointed out that it is time to stop trying to sell this mess as a youth movement. it is not true. After the last 10 years Marc from Troy give me 1 reason why I should have faith in CW or his people. CW himself made the point of saying” build a team everyone can be proud of and then worry about the building” I am real proud of my 30th place team that has the entire hockey world in stiches with the way it is being run! This is someone who we want to run a project of this size. Call the town of Oyster Bay and get on them too about saying NO to CW and his vision!
can they get an ok on say the parking and baseball field and we know for sure they have it on the coliseum right? so why doesnt wang do those things then try and get the ok for the big buildings then say the canal then the shops closer to the coliseum and then go to the outside of the colisuem? you know just one step at a time. or do we have to get everything at once? i just want this project done already. just a thought. i just cant stand the commercial since the lights dim and your getting pumped because the game is almost on and then that goes on and it just ruins all excitment. sure you get pumped again and start cheering when they get out but man is it a letdown. i cant help but laugh. its so stupid.
aim… please just stop being an islander fan. would be so much easier on you and the rest of the world.
im not sure but is this so-called Stupidvisor prepping for a run at County Executive?
also, what is the inside going to look like? some stadiums look badass inside but the colisuem looks beaten and old. maybe they should get orange and white and blue seats and stuff also isnt it darker in other arenas or is it just me.
TimQ - Yeah, you’re right. I guess what I’m thinking is that he should be calling in the troops so to speak. Get more than just the fans of his sports team to start making noise. And maybe that all comes back to CB’s suggestion about changing that commercial.
“The sad part about all this is that if he actually tried and succeeded with getting a truly competitive team on the ice in his almost decade of ownership, he would have gotten the public support he needs for the project he wants.”
I’m afraid there is more than a grain of truth in this, though I attribute the failure more to miscalculation than simple greed. If an all out effort had been made to build and maintain a winner FIRST, a new arena would likely be done or close to it by now.
“All Charles Wang and Scott Rechler want to do is pave a parking lot and put up paradise.”
Just wanted you to know that the excellent Joni Mitchell reference was not missed
Kevin, as has been laid out here previously, if Wang just does the Coliseum, and the few things that you’ve recommended, and then goes back to the town for an OK on the rest, he has no leverage. He can’t threaten to leave, because he’s committed here. The town can then just say no on everything else, and Wang is stuck with a beautiful new Coliseum and no development around it to help support his losses on the Isles. The baseball stadium is so far off the central core of this project that it isn’t even worth mentioning.
well the field is part of the plan. what if he did everything but the colisuem. i agree with you tho.
valentino, send that exact post to ToH right now.
arent the ducks playing on the field? who is going to play there? is there a point to it in the first place?
Mike #72 - That’s one perspective. Another perspective is that he’s a visionary that see a path forward (with a reward attached). If it weren’t for the incentive of a reward very few entrepreneurs would bother to follow through on ideas. Unfortunately Wang has to navigate through a landscape of incompetence on this one. Henry Ford once said “Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal.”
Bystander and others, I totally disagree. You’re being too narrow minded. When you look at Kate Murray’s website, when you read Joe Ra’s statement today, they refer to our “suburban character.” That clearly means opposition to developments like the Lighthouse. To think that they’d think otherwise if we were in playoff contention is just crazy. If the lack of success on the ice is the issue, why do they favor an immediate overhaul of the Coliseum?
“if Wang just does the Coliseum, and the few things that you’ve recommended, and then goes back to the town for an OK on the rest, he has no leverage.”
Where is the leverage now? It’s been pointed out all over the place that Murray and the politicians don’t give a damn about hockey, and could care less. Is moving the Islanders really a significant threat that will affect Murray one way or the other? Her reference to Gary Bettman as “that NHL guy” leads me to believe she does not really care.
CB - Maybe you should post contact info, including email address for TOH and Kate Murray?
Tom #76 I am still laughing at that comment. 06-07 I did not pay my invoice untill September 1st. I got a call from a higher up in the NYI saying please be a fan still and do not give up your tix. I kept em. Since 1984-85 I have been to every home game missing maybe 20 total in that time. Dont know of too may people other the Bill H. (keep skating) that can say that. I sat thru so many follies before CW that when he bought the team I like so many others had real hope. That is why I am so bitter sitting thru this day after day year after year has taken it’s toll BIG TIME. I can tell you so many people share my opinion. Some do not. Tell me how things have gotten better since 1999 when Milstein and Gluckstern were here. They have not. 10 wasted years. Still a joke still no building and I like so many others still there every game. How many games do you attend Tom? Talk to some of us that are left that have been there forever day after day. You will be very surprised to learn of the bitterness from many people
Maybe we should all email the new NY State Senator
Um last time I checked the Islanders offered competive contracts to Ryan Smyth and other well known NHL players who all said NO. They didn’t want to play in the colesium. They say many players feel that its just the colesium and the Marriott and thats all Long Island has. Wang & Snow have tried to get people to come here and it didn’t work so they are trying to build from within. I am on board with this and the Lighthouse Project. Who else is?
Islestherapy….Oh I will…dont you worry….my point is…everyone should get all over nassau county and TOH about it….this is totally ludicrous….there is no reason why this partisan political BS has to continue…the economy is going to hell…people are losing their jobs and their homes…with that being said..can you imagine how much tax revenue nassau county is losing out on???
for every person who gets laid off…thats one less person the county gets to deduct taxes from…for every repossessed home…thats one less house to collect tax revenue from…
if these IDIOTS had any common sense…they would be rushing this project through just to be able to recoup and realize all the NEW tax revenue it would create…
1) more jobs = more tax money for hempstead
2) more housing = more real estate taxes for hempstead
3) more businesses = more tax on the real estate and the additional business thats generated that they collect tax revenue on for hempstead..
I can go on and on…ITS COMMON SENSE..
HELEN KELLER WOULD BE MORE IN TOUCH WITH WHAT THE RIGHT THING TO DO IS..AND SHE WAS BLIND AND DEAF….KATE MURRAY YOU SUCK!
Well, voters and constituents are part of the political process. Hint, hint. Some of you don’t need to be told that.
You know, over the last week, Nick and others have made really good non-hockey points supporting the Lighthouse. I respect that. I know I am missing something in the whole argument, probably mostly because I do not live on Long Island, and only go to the TOH to see Islanders games when I’m in town. The development means little to me personally, save maybe a few more places to eat before the game.
But I know that Islanders fans pack that building out when there is even a glimmer of hope for a competitive team in a given year. I really believe with a new building and a real NHL team on the ice, the place would be full, and the team would be profitable. I think it’s an abolute shame that such a loyal and passionate fan base that is dying to spend its money to see a competitive team may very well not get that chance because the team might move to KC…a place where there is little interest in hockey…over a real estate deal.
That’s not a statement for or against the Lighthouse. Just an unfortunate fact. This area can support a team, Lighthouse or no. I wish they could be mutually exclusive points, but sort of understand why they can’t be, I guess. Just venting some frustration…
UIF: maybe you’re right. Maybe Kate Murray couldn’t care less if the Islanders leave. If that’s the case, then no amount of leverage is possible.
But if the plan is recommended to do the Coliseum alone and then hope for the rest of the project, Wang is stuck with a guaranteed money loser. He’s going to make damn sure that doesn’t happen.
88 JayK on Jan 23rd, 2009 14:39:18 said:
Bystander and others, I totally disagree. You’re being too narrow minded. To think that they’d think otherwise if we were in playoff contention is just crazy.
My point is a winning team brings more fans, more support, more $$$. A cup contender for several years would by now have produced enough groundswell to overcome piddling around by the TOH.
Jayk, look i just feel That Wang is using the Islanders as a poster child for the LightHouse project when back in 2002 he stressed that he needed a new building.
Now back then that was all he needed to put a winner on the ice and to get FA’s to come here. Those were words coming out of the Organization!
Heck i am all for a 150 Acre Developement for Jobs, Tax’s for the county and what ever else comes along with it.
My point is Wang wont move the Team becuase it might cost more to do it! Since when KC is a Hockey Town;well it is not i work for a company based out of KC and this is a College Football town NOT HOCKEY (not proven) and Wang would have to Market it and also put quality on the Ice which means paying up and WANG does not want to spend money.That is why we have a youth movement and a fire sale every year.
The only money that Wang wants to spend is on the LightHouse, and again i never Heard Wang Publically say he would sink money into the Islanders when the lighthouse is started or after it is finished, EVER! We all just assume that!
I am still not convinced we need the WHOLE project for the Islanders to exsit, yet in the long run it would hopefully benefit everybody. Wang “WILL” re-work the plans to start with some of the project, ” I’ll Bet 1 Ranger Game of my season Tickets to anybody who feels different, if i am right you pay me Face value of the 4 seats $90.00 each” Who’s in!!!
TimQ 87-Wang is a visionary?? Visionary of what?-the worst team in the NHL whose team never once won even one playoff series in the very few years the team even made the playoffs during his ownership? That’s some visionary. He’s a visionary in the same way English Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain was with Hitler in 1938 and in the same way the Captain of the Titanic was on April 14, 1912. Furthermore the only incompetents CW has had to navigate through are the inexperienced incompetent sycophants that he has hired to follow his insane orders without question or comment. The best thing would be if Wang would give up and sell the Islanders now, just like he did the Dragons and let a new owner come in that wants to develop a winning team and not just overdevelop the real estate.
Aim, The team had 92 points 2 years ago and then everyone left for more money. Blake left for the money in Toronto - Lokk how weel that turned out for him. Poti asked for 1 year deal and left for more money. Has been replaced by Streit. Everyone wanted to get rid of Yashin. Kozlov was picked up off the scrap heap by the isles. Even the Devils dumped him the year before he came to isles. He played well 1 year and then Washington threw money at him he left. We made atempt at Smyth and he took less to play in Colorodo. Drury took less to play with the Rangers. No one wanted to play here even after a playoff year. Why??? Everyone is killing Snow for that Smyth deal. Where is O’meara - ECHL, Nilsson was benched for a while in Edmonton. There was a plan to have Smyth lead an go from there. When he didn’t resign and plan B in Drury didn’t sign you have to re-evaluate. Finishing 8 every year is not going to cut it either. And it was your Ted Nolan that did not like Nilsson. Give me proof that Wang does not care for this team. He spent money from Day 1. The old owners prior to Wang tried to buy out SMG and SMG emphatically said the lease is not up for negotiation. They even told Wang. All those playoffs the last 8 years and sell outs none of that goes to the team all goes to SMG. So even if as you say Wang could have already renovated the arena he would have spent his money fixing the place and all the benefits would go to SMG. Christ sakes the county approved this project over the Mets owners and others. All had development of whole property not just arena. TOH has no authority to tell Wang go ahead fix the arena. It’s county property.
From what I understand the minor league baseball field would be for a new team in the Atlantic League ( The independent league that the Ducks are in ) which would immediately set up a natural rivalry: Nassau Team vs. Ducks ( Suffolk team )
renovating just the coliseum doesnt help wang…he still has to contend with the worst lease imaginable…the rest of the project will help keep him in the black until he can renegotiate his lease when it comes due…SMG and the TOH are killing him with the current lease. Refurbishing the NVMC is like throwing good money after bad at this point.
“If that’s the case, then no amount of leverage is possible.”
JayK - the leverage should be all of the non-hockey great stuff you guys are talking about! So many here think the Lighthouse, even without the Isles, would be a great thing that will revitalize the area and prevent young people from leaving in droves. I agree it can be all that as well. That’s what should be pushed on the TOH then. Using hockey as leverage on a person who probably could not explain offsides, when the fan base may be at its lowest point ever because of the poor product on the ice (thus less pressure from voters)…I don’t fully understand that. But this is why we may lose our team, unfortunately.
As far as all the declarations that Wang will not move the team to Kansas City:
What he won’t do is move the team to Kansas City or Hamilton, Ontario and then continue to operate it. He would first sell it to somebody who would, or he would move it, and then sell it.
Either way, what he won’t do is renovate the Coliseum only and leave the Islanders there with nothing around it.
That isn’t going to happen. GET OVER IT.
How can you blame Snow and/or Wang for NHL players not taking more money and more years to come play here???
Johnny in post #100 you have some good points for sure but you ask WHY as far as players not wanting to come here??/ Look again at our owner and the way he conducts business. Players do not want to be part of the Wang/Snow/insert name of the day side show plain and simple. The fact that players take less money to play elsewhere is very alarming. Blame the building all you want but it is the management and the perception of the NYI that is keeping people away. Get around a little bit talk to some hockey people about these points the truth hurts yes it does. But the truth it is!
Exactly, JayK. It’s impossible to make money off the Coliseum because of the current lease, and the local governments have already said they will not put up any money toward a new building. Therefore, the only way to get it done is to develop the surrounding land to recoup the private investment in the arena.
UIF - thanks for your kind words and your honesty about your feelings on the project. To address your question, I point you to something Jim Baumbach said a few months ago in Newsday. You could think of this like a contract negotiation where the Lighthouse wants the whole development that Nassau County approved, and the ideal for the town is a new arena and not having to approve anything else. The Town is very keen on getting a new arena, so the leverage is gone when you give them what they wanted most before the negotiations even begin.
I hope we can persuade those of you who are regurgitating the same points that have been discussed ad nauseam. If not, I’m sorry to hear that, and I hope you guys can eventually get over whatever’s bothering you.
bettman is on with francesa
to all of you who think WANG is only interested in the real estate….
WAKE UP…of course he is interested in the real estate project..you should also know that the money he makes on the real estate project will fund the NYI for many years to come….want to throw big money at top leve free agents much like MSG and the NYR dp? NO PROBLEM !
Free agents are like sharks…when they smell blood in the water…they all come for the feeding….You should hope to god WANG gets this thing done..because he will buy a championship once he has the cash flow to do so…And I for one..have no problem with that…
You want the isles to be great again….stop criticizing the guy and support him instead….from a business perspective…the idea is brilliant.
#104 - Exactly. From what I have always heard Mr. Wang’s alligence FIRST and FOREMOST is to the Island he loves. Yes, the team has become a deep part of that but I can’t imagine HE would move this team anywhere. He will sell before that happens.
the players do not want to come here becuase there is nothing here. how can you say it is snow or wang. some people…
nice post johhny.
Why is it that governments waste trillions of dollars on useless projects, handouts, and nonsense and then become fiscal hawks when it comes time to develop something? It takes 20 years and millions of wasted tax dollars to fix a strip of the LIE and noone cares but the TOH won’t pay for the Lighthouse project. Why? How much money has the TOH thrown away over the years? This project creates jobs, tax revenue and save the team. You will never have another professional franchise if the Islanders leave. If the TOH was serious about the Coliseum renovation, they would take the building under eminent domain, cancel the crippling SMG lease and give Wang the ability to act like every other NHL owner. In my humble opinion, there probably isn’t enough kickbacks or votes generated by the project for them to care.
How about Subterranean Hempstead Blues?
Isles are in the basement, tankin’ on the season
I’m on Point Blank, thinkin’ ’bout the reasons
Bad drafts, dumb trades, front-office charades
Fifty games played and an injury parade
Look out, fans! Nothing getting done
Waiting on a new trend while riding out the old one
Snowie in a three-piece suit on the telephone
Wants a first-round pick, but they don’t wanna give him one
New coach, new kids, old vets, prospects,
Twelve third-liners and eleven second-round picks
Looking for a rebuild, tired of the quick-fix
Playin in an old barn in the middle of the sticks
Trying to save face, want to build a new space
Town drags its feet so they may be movin’ someplace
Look out, fans! It’s feeling old
Fifteen years with the same tale told
Feeling down, can’t get a shovel in the ground
And the town of Hempstead keeps jerkin’ us around
Nick,
I guess my remaining question is, why wouldn’t the town want the whole project? Seems like they’d benefit more from that than just a renovated building.
This issue is harder for me to reconcile than fixing the team on the ice. One day I’m pulling for Wang 100% because people say the Isles would have left a long time ago if not for him, and that he truly wants what’s best for the team. Then the next day I’m cursing the guy because it looks like he’s holding the team and fans hostage. I hope the former point is the truth and latter is just me being paranoid.
NickClassic: I’m interested in your point that the Town wants to be sure the Coliseum continues to operate. They’ve said that it’s OK with them if it gets redone, but if it went away, why would they care? I know that question sounds incredibly stupid, but does the town fully realize that not only is there no hope for the Islanders without the Lighthouse, there really isn’t hope for a Coliseum without the Islanders. The losses would just pile up for the county, and it would eventually be better for them to talk away from it. Thoughts?
nightfly…that was freakin’ amazing.
Sorry, I meant WALK away from it.
So, when will Kate Murray and the TOH get the picture? This seems to be a movement, similar to a snowball rolling downhill. HOW ABOUT TOWN OF HEMPSTEAD NIGHT?
Get me 21 people. I need one person to with excellent writing skills to come up with something on a flyer and 20 people to stand outside the concourse and hand them out (me being one of them of course).
When Kate gets wind of 16,000 people chanting ‘FIRE KATE’ or ‘WE HATE KATE’ … you think that’ll make a difference? It will because those translate into the margin of victory votes that she will lose the next election by.
I’ll be more than happy to start making copies.
Unlike many others around here - uh, “Aim” - I don’t use a screen name and, yes, this is where I live.
First things first: I respect your passion as a fan. Really, I do. And that was a passionate rant (74) about how much money you pour into this team. But here’s the problem with that: you’re using your frustration with your “habit” to justify skepticism and/or outright opposition to a project that would affect so much more than the Islanders. How about you actually address - or, at the very least, acknowledge - the points that me and so many others have made about jobs, taxes, etc, once in a while instead of just pissing and moaning about how bad the team is, all while bringing up silly old comments about “sumo goalies”? Because here’s the thing: nobody is forcing you to spend all of that money on the Islanders, but someone can damn well force you to spend more money on things like increased property taxes.
And, for what it’s worth, I’m not just trying to lecture from afar. Two things about that: first is that municipal budgeting is what I do for a living. I know what I’m talking about as it regards things like property taxes and what will happen to them if other sources of revenue aren’t created. Second, if I lived on LI then I would probably be spending the same money on season tickets that you are. I know the passion for this team, too. I try to make at least one trip down for a game every year. Would like it to be more all the time, but this year wife and I are coming down for two games. And I buy the jerseys, the hats, the Center Ice package (specifically for the Isles, because the idiots at the NHL have deemed our area Sabres territory - even though we’re closer to not only the Isles and Rangers, but also the Bruins and Canadiens, for that matter), etc, etc. I even subscribe to the magazine. Like probably most of us around here, I spend the money, too.
So we know how you feel about the team. What about the other stuff? Do you care, and, if not, why?
Apologies, CB, for the length of the above…
I am with angry pete….we can either debate and complain about how much the isles stink or we can be proactive and do our part to help this along…politicians work for us…lets show hempstead we care about the lighthouse and everything it stands for…islanders or not…
i would gladly hand out flyers…as well as support a peaceful show of support
CB, perhaps a new lighthouse ad should show construction workers on site building something with a voice over talking about the 1000s of jobs to be created with no public $$s in a down economy and mention Ms. Murray by name as the “biggest stumbling block to employing more Long Islanders this summer”.
Then show the same construction guys in their civvies cheering it up in the stands after a (rare) Islander’s goal…
Play that over and over and over at ever game. They can reach b/w 10 and 15,000 potential voters a game.
Fight dirty. Fight to win.
A solution to the lease situation is part of the Lighthouse Group’s winning bid. Once the development is approved, the Group will negotiate with SMG a buyout of the lease. If those negotiations fail, then the County will kill the lease (eminent domain). Interestingly, the County’s RFP (Request for Proposals) for the development made it clear that the winning bidder would be operating the coliseum and that SMG would be out.
It’s also clear from the RFP that what the County was ultimately looking for was a redevelopment of the entire site. In fact, one of the County’s goals for this project is to have it provide “increased property and sales tax revenues for the County with improved economic and public benefits for the Town of Hempstead and surrounding communities.”
If you go to the Nassau County website, the Coliseum Redevelopment Project section holds some fascinating information. All the fine print, so to speak.
Whoa whoa……peaceful? Who said anything about peaceful? Have you seen my screen name?
JUST KIDDING CB!
I’ll even design 20 shirts so that we LOOK LEGIT while doing it.
Bettman on WFAN seems that he can’t understand why this project hasn’t been approved.
I cant believe im saying this. Good job by Bettman. He really is going to bat for this.
Marc yes it is a passionite rant. i am about over my comment numbers so CB sorry but I wanted to answer MArc and a couple of others. there is no doubting that fan support for this team exists in a very big way. In regards to the issue I am not opposed to the Lighthouse as i am to the people that want to build it. Yes you and other posters make very good points about alot of things. I am not opposed to the entire project either. I have to live here. Scale the thing down thats all a reduced version without 400 foot buildings would be better IMO. As far as CW goes. My issues and opinions on the way he does things are very well documented. If a credible person comes in here and wants to develop the property I am all for it. i go on record as saying YES develop the property BUT there are many issues that I and many others have about CW’s business methods and the amount and type of development he wants done. but remember for all of us here opinions aside LETS GO ISLANDERS
Comment Guidelines: http://www.islanderspointblank.com/2008/12/comment-guidelinesthese-are-effective-immediately/
Appreciate the passion, but some folks are on the verge of getting Murrayed…CB
Just as a side note to MARC….You would be surprise to know that my county/town taxes really arent that bad. I own a home here and like everyone else it is the school taxes that are killing us the TOH and Nassau county taxes I really dont have a problem with either
SORRY CB SEE YOU ALL ON THE NEXT THREAD!!!
nightfly… that was GREAT! I only wish that I had thought of it myself lol!
Someone needs to record this… and film someone sitting in the parking lot holding up cards to go along with the words!
118 AngryPete: I think that something as simple as “Lighthouse NOW!” would be a lot more effective than people screaming that they hate a woman they do not even know. Our goal is to urge that this project gets done, whether people hate her or not simply does not matter.
CB- Nick (AKA Nick Classic / St. Nick) has been leaving golden nuggets of wisdom regarding the LHP for a while … back to our heavy Logie blog participation … he’s made it his personal mission to be informed and be a productive activist in regards to the TOH’s handliing (mis-handling) of the entire scope of the project.
Hey CB,
I have a question about SMG and their contract with the Isles. On the message board that I use, there has been discussion on why Wang hasn’t bought out SMG yet.
So my question is, how much money is Wang not seeing by having that deal with SMG? What does SMG make money on? How much does it cost to buy out SMG? Why has Wang not bought out SMG?
Thanks,
H07
Lots of great ideas from you guys. I like the suggestions from Valentino and AngryPete. Let’s use the Feb. 21 ToH night to galvanize support. We can hand out flyers, start chants, and try to inform other fans. It’s a Saturday night game, so we should be able to pack the house if we start planning for this now. We also might be able to get some press out of it. CB or Nick Classic - either of you able to organize this?
AngryPete - You sound like a community organizer. Maybe you should run for president. I’d be happy to hand out flyers on the 21st.
I doubt CB can organize it, because of his ties to the Islanders. It’s pretty clear that the Islanders/Wang/Lighthouse do not want to be seen as doing anything to so publicly get in Hempstead’s face. But Chris, if you want to serve as a clearinghouse for the emails of some of us who regularly post here, so we can contact each other and do some organization, I’m up for that. I don’t want to post my email here.
angry pete for president !
Hey Nick, i believe i heard that their is Tax payer money going into the coliseum project if Wang excepts it, i think i heard about 60 mill!
CB, i heard you say on the Fan that their is Tax payer money going to the project?
Although Small compared to the total # of 3 bill. However their is Tax payer money allocated for it,CB can you clear this up! what is the Tax Payer amount$$?
Chris TMC - I couldn’t agree more. Keep the focus on what needs to get done, and do it in a manner that isn’t hostile or vulgar.
Angry Pete is our Al Sharpton
NO LIGHTHOUSE!!!!! NO PEACE!!!!!
The only difference is we have to protest on a Saturday night because we all have jobs.
WOW!!! 80 whole emails to the TOH. Murray must be quaking in her boots. Thta’s 80 out of 766,111 residents.
As far as the TOH people being clueless, they still get last tag. Murray is dead on to not get behind this monstrosity.
I live here and I don’t want huge apartment buildings, underground parking,
and another shopping mall.
Why does it have to be all or nothing with Wang. Let him scale back his project
and perhaps it would become more acceptable.
And for all of you novices to politics out there the Nassau County Legislature
only voted for this project because they knew full well that they were just passing the buck to the TOH. Because without TOH approval this thing is dead in the water. And as it stands now, it’s dead. Good for Kate Murray for not buckling under……..SW
Sir William
Good for Kate Murray? Well then good for you 2. Now we hate you as much as we hate her.
Congrats !
Sir William, I commend you for your consistency.
What I don’t commend you for is your utter refusal to accept that a refurbishing/rebuild of the Coliseum alone is not going to happen. That’s a fact.
Please just accept that if there’s no Lighthouse, there’s no Islanders.
Also: it’s not another “mall.” There is shopping there, but it’s hardly another Roosevelt Field.
You won’t have to look at big towers if this doesn’t go through, but you’re not going to look at the Islanders either. If you refuse to accept that, you’re just in denial.
Good for her for not buckling under to what? How about taking a stand, voicing an opinion, on what is likely the most important issue to be presented to the town of Hempstead under her watch? Showing support for an empty suit spouting empty words and implausibilities gets a “good for you”? This is the expectation you have of your elected officials?
As far as “last tag,” I’m sure Hempstead businesses will be ecstatic with the possibility of Sesame Street On Ice being the only regular tenant of the monstrosity that is the NVMC as it currently stands. “Last tag” is Wang selling the team and Murray watching significant sources of revenue to the town fade to nothingness. So yeah, good for you Kate, way to take a stand.
Some of you need to calm down with the anger, cooler heads prevail. Screaming at this woman or anyone involved in this project isn’t goin to make them get off the pot.
Protesting in a mature manner with signs that show support is a good idea but it must be done in the right way.
Wang was offered to get the building rebuilt, he wants it his way, the town wants it their way..just one of the many stand stills until someone gives in..meanwhile back at the ranch we ( fans ) face losing our team over this issue? and I just wonder if Wang really cares if LI loses the Islanders?..
I don’t think he’s got enough hockey savy to understand, to him it’s a business dealing..I dunno! but the lighthouse sure does get a lot of attention for something that’s not even in the making as of yet.
What is the TOH’s plans to replace the revenue lost by the Islanders? Raise property taxes I suppose.
Why do people consistently believe the crap comming out of TOH Wang was offered to have building rebuilt & he wants the whole thing. The TOH can offer to rebuild all they want they have no authority to do so. The county owns the arena. THe county asked for proposals to develop THE WHOLE PARCEL. It’s just grandstanding and trying to make Wang look like the bad guy in this by say oh we offered to do the arena but he wants the whole thing. Well the whole thing was approved by an overwhelming vote at the county level. The TOH job now is to go through these studies say yay or nay and that’s it. Otherwise we go back to square one and county asks for RFP’s to fix coliseum and that’s when we say good bye Isles. Well I’m done with my 4 comments. thanks CB
People have been cool for quite some time, Dmarie. But I’m sure Kate Murray will appreciate your characterization of the efforts of the voters to get her to do her job.
Meanwhile, you turn it back on Wang. Perhaps you need to be a little more dispassionate … and a little less obvious.
nightfly:
That was classic, now I’ll have Dylan in my head the rest of the night (not that that’s a bad thing). Very creative!!
I wish we could have Dylan perform that at a home game.
What happened to BD? He or “they” pulled some of his blogs down..
KATE MURRAY SUCKS……I WILL BE AVAILABLE TO ORGANIZE A GROUP
JMarie Wangs wants what was passed by the county, ” the whole development. You’re acting like he asked for one thing and now he is asking for something else that wasn’t originally agreed upon which is false. Wang got approval for the whole project not just the renovation. TOH is a mess and it’s becoming clearer by the day.
ISS Top 30 2009 prospects, January
1 Tavares, John C 9/20/1990 L 6.00 200 London OHL
2 Hedman, Victor LD 12/18/1990 L 6.06 220 Modo SweE
3 Svensson-Paajarvi, Magnus LW 4/12/1991 L 6.01 200 Timra SweE
4 Cowen, Jared LD 1/25/1991 L 6.04.7 218 Spokane WHL
5 Duchene, Matt C 1/16/1991 L 5.11 196 Brampton OHL
Say we finished 28th. We would still take Duchene?
I’ve moved to Brielle NJ ten years ago. Fan since 1980, when Nystrom scored during my cousin Riche’s communion and the whole house went nuts. Hooked ever since, through good and bad. They gave us 4 great parades down Hempstead Turnpike…..maybe it’s time that all that support this team and this project stage a friendly parade of our own down Hempstead Turnpike…you know, slow down the day just a little bit. I’d be willing to drive back to LI for that. Hey, if Sharpton can do it, so can the Islander fans!!!
Wow…didn’t see ANGRY PETE above on the blog….guess Petes think alike…..GO ANGRY PETE!!!!!!!
ps, I’m not angry Pete….just angry.
Sir William
While i agree with you that your assessment of nassau county politics is dead on (suozzi silence is indicative) you are completely in denial about the state of your home town.
If i had to guess you are a baby boomer or the offspring of a very opinionated one who left the boros to escape to the country which was once nassau county. Your vision and what Hempstead actually is is very skewed. As a brooklynite who thought long and hard about Hempstead as a home for my kids over a decade ago I came to the sad conclusion that Nassau is dying in every aspect imaginable. This project will
not only provide the revitalization that the area desperately needs but more importantly will halt the degradation of a town that was once very beautiful…Without it your children will have to leave just like you or your dad had to before.
Anyone ever stop and think what happens to the land up there if the Islea leave? It will then be a decrepit old building in the middle of nowhere with no paying tenant. We as a county will then be stuck with a giant worthless piece of crap. Will it lay fallow? Will we use it to store sand to fight beach erosion? Or will someone else, like Fred Wilpon, try to develop it? The development is happening sooner or later. Lets do it while we have a hockey team before we are trying to lure the Ducks out of Islip to fill the hole.
Nightfly–well done!! Chris TMC, love the idea of the placards a la “Don’t Look Back.” Didn’t know we had Dylan Heads here.
And Aim from #22, there are not only bars and restaraunts right outside, and inside, the Wachovia Center in Philly, there are THREE OTHER STADIUMS, all brand new.
Ok, two brand new ones
How about if they do a cover of the Wyclef Jean song “Gone Til’ November” and change it to “Gone in November”? I think the local politicians might get the message.
i am a 20 year old die hard islander fan whose family has had season tix since 1972. When all the talk came out about Kansas City and moving the team, i started bitchin to my dad how the Islanders need the lighthouse ect. What my dad pointed out to me is that although the NY Islanders need the lighthouse, the people of Long Island and especially Nassau county need the lighthouse. He explained to me that since he moved to the town of Hempstead 40 years ago , the town hasnt done one thing to further develope , and its looked the exact same. That really opened my eyes as a college student who will be looking for a job in a year or so and to one day start a family on long island , this project needs to be done not only to save the Islanders but to save Long Island.. I will be sure that as a first time eligible voter , my vote will not be going to Mrs Murray, the same women who took 10 years to close the crime stricken courtesy motel in hempstead.. amen .. lets go islanders
Terry, I’ve thought about what would happen if the Isles left.
The answer is simple: nothing. You wouldn’t have a building. Eventually, the costs of operating it would become so burdensome to the county, assuming the loss of the Islanders as tenants, that they’d just tear it down.
Whenever I see the Lighthouse commercials, I think of the movie, “The Island”. Explain why a new building isn’t profitable, considering the Isles get $20 million from Cablevision every year? What about an SMG buyout, a new building and a competitive hockey club. Sounds like a recipe for a profitable organization.
Well said Valentino #109 … I was one of those people that felt that Wang was looking to use the Isles for leverage to make a sweetheart real estate deal … then after actually educating myself and tapping into my true inner capitalist … I understood exactly what Wang was doing … he’s a business man … and he owns a business … and businesses make money … and if Wang gets what he wants … he’ll make a profitable business that serves the community in the TOH very well … and will only enhance the revenue streams that the Isles as a business can tap into .. thus allowing the creation of a more competitive team on the ice .. thus attracting more fans and even more $$$$ … Brilliant and I support Wang on this endevour to not only impove the Isles and the building in which they play … but the whole pie in the sky project for the betterment of the entire area.
Terry 159 I love the layout in Philly as far as the sports complex. 10 years ago when CW came in 10 years ago I thought an awesome idea would have been to build an NHL arena and a football stadium for the Jets on the Roosevelt Raceway property. THAT would have been awesome. At that property now is a HUGE development which would be 2 miles from the Lighthouse.
The letter said it’s the town’s responsibility to assure “existing residents of the suburban way of life that most sought when they chose to live here.”
We no longer live in the suburbs people think we do get over it and build this
There’s no one out there besides this Murray woman who is against the lighthouse. I have not read one article or heard one argument that logically points out any negatives. Some say that its too big and needs to be scaled down. Why?- so we can preserve a bit of the historic parking lot that has been there since 1972? Its obviously a critical project that will bring so many benefits to the TOH, Nassau, Long Island. Get in done already!
19 ISLE in NJ 22 -
I am happy to hear you see my point.
In today’s newsday there was hardly anything said. The Nassau County Officials didn’t say much at all. Newsday should’ve done a better job at asking more thorough questions.
Regarding the Draft position, Place in standings guarantees us NOTHING; All that it guarantees is more ballots in the box. You know Toronto or Ottawa will still be the favorites…we already have too many Big Named Players on our Team!!
Loud and clear Valentino … people need to understand what is at stake … so many people just look at the surface of the issue without being properly informed and then let their emotions cloud their judgement … kind of like when I bought my first Trans Am … a 1978 “Smokey and the Bandit” black with gold trim … I didn’t care that it had 100k plus miles … I wanted the car b/c it looked cool. LOL!! Keep in mind I drove that between Staten Island and Nassau Cty. for school and the Isles I put a lot more miles on it … changed oil regularly … but the ugly reality was the engine was old and abused before I bought it … so 10k miles after buying it .. PING!!! Blew a rod on the Belt Parkway halfway between my home and desitination … Bryan Trottier’s Skating Academy … sucked to miss a day of hockey with #19.
Point is … you gotta look deeper below the surface. Wang needs more than an arena … he needs a broader revenue stream… I understood that finally last year.
I think people need to focus their energy on supporting the LHP rather than channeling their energy into hating Kate Murray … Ms. Murray is a person … and I’ll tell ya this much … people can be spiteful … in her mind if she feels she has nothing to gain with a developed NVMC area … she’ll look at “US” Isles fans as a bunch of angry hateful pee-ons and perhaps take pleasure in making the choice not to support the LHP … especially if the bulk of her constituency doesn’t give a damn … keep in mind … if the Isles can’t find 16k plus a night to feel passionate enough to fill the building vs. her 700k plus TOH population … what will she care?
Use your passion to support the LHP and show Kate you care about the Isles and TOH… and would like her on your side … not opposed.
mike if the standings are the same at the end of the season, we could only falling back 1 spot. so we still get a franchise player in hedman. its not that bad….
The Isles home game 2/21 against the Devils is Town of Hempstead night. This must be a sellout and we must get the message across.
I’ll be there …already have tix
AN ALLMAN’S POSTER!!!!
Chris Botta, YOU are my hero.
Meet me at the Beacon 13-14Mar.
Back Where It All Begins!!!
Hey Mariner 81 go over to the Isles talk back at the Newsday site. There’s a nut job over there screaming that this is all Wangs fault and that he should just start rebuilding the coliseum before he has full approval on the whole project. The guy swears up and down that Kate is right and that Wang is somehow the one who is being ridiculous! He also has stated that he read only 80 fans have contacted the office regarding this matter. She would have no reason to lie about that because apparently we have entered an alternate universe where politicians have no agenda and always tell the truth. The guy must work for the town because he’s calling us all idiots over here for believing that Kate is the bad guy/girl in all of this. Check it out if you want a good laugh.
CB, can you respond to post number 98 PLEASE? I am curious to see what someone who knows Wang (and has REAL ‘insider’ information) has to say about his theory.
post #99> I’m curious as to who you think would buy a business that loses millions of dollars a year.
Just wanna say that Nightfly that was AMAZING! You are VERY talented. LOL if you could come up with something PRO Islander haha maybe the team would take you in!
Chris M on Jan 23rd, 2009 18:17:53 said:
“Whenever I see the Lighthouse commercials, I think of the movie, “The Island”…”
Hahaha… thats funny, but I can kinda see why youd say that. Whenever I see the movie “The Island” I think of the movie “Parts: The Clonus Horror” featured on the show Mystery Science Theater 3000. I recommend it to everyone who has ever seen “The Island”
TOH statement “to assure “existing residents of the suburban way of life that most sought when they chose to live here.”
ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!!!!!! WHAT A JOKE!!!!
I can not believe that it has actually come to this. The Lighthouse Project has to appeal to Governor Paterson and maybe even all the way up to President Obama (hate typing that). This would a perfect time for his economic stimulus speech. Creating job when companies are laying off. Creating additional tax revenue to keep taxes in check. Giving a nice place to visit with the family. What more could you ask for??????
Could the Lighthouse Project scale it down a bit…. sure. I for one do not agree with Luxury Condos or any additional housing for that matter.
Either way you talk it up, this has to get done!!!!!!
I have been an Islanders fan for 30+ years and I can honestly say that if the TOH continues this bull**** I have no problem with Wang moving or selling this team. Wang loves Long Island and I understand this, but enough is enough.
RANT OVER!!!!!!!!
LOOK, have we not seen this before? rewind 5 years…the new york jets want a new stadium, placed on the lower west side of manhattan it doubles as a summer olympic worthy venue, holding 85,000 seats, and required PUBLIC FINANCING, of course this turned out to only be a dream, the city rejected the proposal, and in effect, the jets just built a new stadium, on the grounds adjacent from their old stadium, we dont need the lighthouse, but wang is too f ing stubborn to realize that, it is true that we could of had a brand new 21st century arena by now if the town of hempstead had not been so slow reviewing what they had to, the county could have already approved this, CMON, WEVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT THIS SINCE 2004, AND PROGRESS SO FAR??……ZERO…..GOD DAMN IT, THE ISLANDERS WILL HAVE BEEN MOVED TO KANSAS CITY BY THE TIME THE COUNTY GETS THE BATON FROM THE TOWN OF HEMPSTEAD
BUILD THE FRICKING LIGHTHOUSE
OR ITS TIME TO GET OFF THIS ISLE
David #184…… What the heck are you talking about????????
Regarding the issues discussed by #55 and the discussion on ESPN/1050 between yourself and Bob Galerstine today. Do you know there is an existing spur off the Hempstead line starting east of Garden City? It’s used (I think) for the circus, so it extends to just north of the Coliseum. That seems to mean that it can be extended to the Coliseum through Mitchell Field without arousing the NIMBY issues. It appears to be non-3rd rail, so a light rail should work. I live in Brooklyn and use the LIRR/LI Bus (and local car services) to get to/from games.