GET OUTTA TOWN!
The Islanders have a lease?!
Newsday – undoubtedly spurred on by politicians, probably from the Town of Hempstead, maybe from the County of Nassau - tried to rattle the chains with this story. It’s written by Eden Laikin, who in this saga seems to have taken on the role of the reporter who covers the other team.
Our reaction to the story…you’re kidding, right?
So there’s a lease, yup. It’s a terrible, terrible lease. The Islanders get nothing from parking and concessions and have to give back some of the ticket and advertising revenue. The lease does not expire until 2015. The story cites a court order upheld more than ten years ago during the Milstein-Gluckstern era. Glorious.
Somehow this is supposed to give the impression that if Hempstead politicians - you know, the folks who admit they are not reading your letters – don’t lift a finger on the Lighthouse, the Islanders still have no choice but to play at the Coliseum.
Yeah, sure it does. LOL.
Comments on this here. If you still want to vent about one Toronto sportswriter who’s laughing through his day, do so in next thread.
37 Responses to GET OUTTA TOWN!
The Islanders have a lease?!
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Brooks Simpson says:
This is an odd article. Did Kate Murray write it?
Seriously … people get out of leases all the time. Wang sells the team to Paul Allen or Mr. Blackberry, they wave some money in front of a financially-strapped government entity, and –poof!–the Islanders are loading the moving trucks.
That Newsday does not appear to be pursuing the story about the behavior of the TOH towards constituents is at least as astonishing. That to my mind is more than a hockey issue.
Wake up, Long Island.
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Couldn’t the county and the team use this to pressure the TOH? Kate Murray is the one holding the whole thing up – the County has their team, supports their team and wants to keep them here.
Use the lease to their advantage, nobody has actually said they want to move or even openly threatened. The exhibition game is nothing more then what it is – a game.
The County needs to do more in my opinion as their say in this is stronger than one of the other municipalities.
This is just getting more stupid as the days pass.
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So Wang is just suppose to lose millions every year because of a horrible lease and stay put? Sounds like extortion to me! I think Wang is a much smarter businessman to just do nothing, don’t you? After all there is a reason why he is a billinaire. I think the TOH maybe banking on this whole lease issue. Not going to happen Katie!
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beatlebailey says:
CB:
Not sure if this has been discussed before but has there been any discussion of Wang and Ratner teaming up to add the Nets as a tenant to the lighthouse? How great would it be having both the NHL and NBA here in Nassau. This makes so much sense I guess it will never happen!..lol -
The PolishPrince says:
I’m sure Charles Wang is shaking in his shoes….
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Eden Laikin covers the Town of Hempstead for Newsday, so most of her writings have that tilt to them.
Let’s remember a few basic principles about the exhibition game and the Saskatoon decision:
1. The Islanders are making about $200k on the Kansas City game, vs. losing money by having an exhibition in the Coliseum. What would you do?
2. They hope to have construction at the Coliseum the next few summers. You have to train somewhere else, and Saskatoon is as good as any.
Hopefully the other angle gets played up. I for one am beyond upset that the Town doesn’t even bother to listen to voters, and we all need to wake up. This is about more than hockey, it’s a way forward.
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Aim says:
NICK CLASSIC I saw you posted a couple of threads ago about people opposing the lighthouse and not having any plans for an alternative. I have been very critical at times so here is my ideas and my pros and cons……Just for the heck of it how many posting live in the TOH and do you guys have full season tix?? I am a resident and have had full season tickets for the last 25 years. I think the land should be developed BUT I have said before scale it down. I dont want to see 2 400 foot towers that is a starting point for me. Underground parking sucks ever try to get out of a parking garage at a sporting event period? May not have another option here I admit. I would feel MUCH better if Wang Lancey and Picker go away. The latter 2 are former CA execs that worked for the NYI for a while and have latched to CW like Sanjay. CW I am just plain sick of him he has lost all of my trust and my faith and has let this die hard down bigtime with 10 years of nothing. During the lockout CW gave the tix holders a plan to keep my money and pay me intrest during the lockout. My payment was $4.00 yes four dollars. I was told after the lockout that I was not getting conventional intrest on my money!!! I do like in the plan the shops canal extra ice arenas and the baseball park.. MY TAXES will not change because of this project. School taxes kill us here! The tax rate for only the school district the project is located in will change NO OTHER. My. town and county taxes are not bad. When the source mall was built my taxes did not change. What makes you think the lighthouse will? If this fight is not about hockey how come no one is flipping out over the Ciro Wire site in Syosset? Ditch the sky scrapers I may feel a bit (not much) better.
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Chuck DiMaggio says:
I’m hoping as much as the next person that the Lighthouse Project gets full approval. Today’s Newsday article about the Islanders lease with Nassau County until 2015 was pretty convincing in that the Islanders are obligated to fulfill the remaining time on the lease. I didn’t get the impression that Nassau County is trying to strong arm the Islanders but only presenting the facts. Is the Town of Hempstead leveraging off Nassau County to take some of the heat off from proponents of the Lighthouse Project? Besides disbanding the franchise, can you please elaborate about what other options the Islanders have besides continuing to play their home games at Nassau Coliseum until 2015? You were working there when Gluckstern and Milstein tried to strong arm the County and you saw what happened.
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Dommy says:
i’ve posted this before but seriously.. chris… is it even possible for wang to play instead of just 1 exhibition game but 10 “home” games in kansas city? he makes more money there. the threat is real. kansas is happy to get a team for a little and prove to the nhl that they should get one (even if it’s not the islanders) isles fans save money on 10 fewer home games, smg gets less money with fewer games at coliseum. kate murray poops her pants. are isles committed to play ALL home games at the coliseum?
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MSA says:
What the article does not mention is that the lease can be broken, or renegotiated, simply by the franchise filing for bankruptcy. The lease would be DOA, and it would be totally legal…
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Matt says:
Joe in reference to post 4, not for nothing Wang knew about the lease when he took on the team so don’t feel bad for him. If this team moves there is no one to blame but Wang. I know Wang has been “patient” and a “saint” through all of this but this is something that he should have known the TOH wasn’t going to give him the keys to the city. Wang made a lot of promises to the fan base, none of which he has kept or seems he has any intentions of keeping at this point. I don’t dislike the guy or anything and if this all works out he WILL be my hero but lets just say thus far for me personally I’m not impressed. Two of my friends that have been watching the team with me (I’m 36) since they were 11 want nothing to do with the team bcs. of all the BS not just with the lighthouse but with the embarrassment that they have turned into. Me, I’ll always be a fan, even through this crap.
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B.P. says:
Aim, I am a ToH resident and I have had season tixx. What is the problem with the towers. Frankly I think theyvare prety damn good looking. And don’t shoot back with this is suburbia. That ship sailed 20 years ago. This is a project being done without our money being included. Nassau County gifted CW the land. he is funding the rest. How could anybody say no to this. I am sorry they already did scale it down. The original high rise tower would have been great.
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Aim, sorry for the double post CB but I think you are dead on right!
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I dont see bankruptcy as an option CW would have way to much to lose including the franchise that he paid 180 mil for. Look at Pitt…Mario was owed the most money and got control of the team. I woould imagine that banks that the NYI have their lines of credit with would stand to be owed the most. Or the franchise could be sold for a bargin basement price and have to be approved by a court. Really dont see any way CW would benefit from this
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I honestly don’t care about the skyscrapers but agree with everything else you posted.
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JayK says:
I think the story provided a public service in spelling out the terms of the lease. But I don’t think this changes the debate over the Lighthouse one bit. I always felt that if the Islanders got the Lighthouse and that they moved, it would be at the end of the lease. Six years..so what? If it is clear that the Lighthouse isn’t going through, and the lease is airtight, the Islanders will simply cut their payroll to the bare minimum, be fully willing to accept losing for the rest of the lease, stockpile great young players and have that time to look for a new home.
AIM: It’s difficult to understand your arguments, since it’s just sort of a stream of words without much cohesion. But the whole point of the Lighthouse and all other similar projects around the country is to have a lot of economic activity on a relatively small piece of property. It’s supposed to be integrated: businesses, residences, recreation, etc. If you start turning over vast amounts of land to above-ground parking, it doesn’t work. The alternative then becomes multi-level parking garages, and they are about the ugliest structures around.
As far as whether your taxes will change under the project: it’s true that one project rarely has a visible impact on tax bills. But the cumulative effect of lost population, young people moving elsewhere, reduced economic activity, developers fleeing for other areas…that DEFINITELY has an impact on your tax bill. It doesn’t happen overnight, but it happens.
And no, they’re not flipping out over the Cero site, but it’s just one more sign that Long Island has sent to the business community that you just can’t get anything done. The Pilgrim State site..the former Grumman site in Calverton…Cero Wire…and maybe the Lighthouse. (I’ll add another one: the Avis headquarters, 7-8 years after Avis pulled out, surrounded by a fence in prime real estate). Our political leaders are fools if they keep sending out signals to the world that they’re too dysfunctional to ever get anything done, and think we’re going to remain a cutting-edge dynamic economic area.
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I think everyone opposed to the Lighthouse should read the findings here. They are truly frightening:
http://www.longislandindex.org/2009_report_key_findings.html -
JAy I agree about the parking might not be much choice but I own a home here and I like my community. It is of my opinion that 2 towers the size of the WFC in lower Manhattan are not needed here. What benefit do we the cizizens get from those 2 towers? Yes the ice canal is nice we all benefit same with the ballpark. The 2 towers are a luxury hotel and luxury condo’s that bring nothing to the table for me. As far as LI goes…Lets all be real here if this does not get built there will not be a mass exoudous from Long Island. That is a joke….OMG the lighthouse got shot down were outta here….When I was in my 20′s I bought a home in the TOH. At the same time Grumman was closing down and 22,000 jobs went with it. That was a REAL issue. LI survived. Other things occupy the plants in Bethpage. Again I like alot of the idea scaled down. I will never trust CW with anything. For anyone who has lived the 10 years of his ownership day in day out I just cant trust what charade will be next!
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AIM, nobody said if we don’t get the Lighthouse there is going to be a “mass exodus.” What has been said by numerous people here is that it is yet one more sign of an internal rot, a cling to the past worldview, a no-can-do attitude that is driving our young people away and sinking our economy relative to the rest of the country. The data on that is irrefutable. The Long Island Index link that I put here should not be ignored.
The county adjacent to the city of New York is always going to have a fair amount of economic activity. But it can be like Westchester or Bergen, which would embrace something like the Lighthouse, or it can be like Hudson or Nassau, which are losing population. Make your choice.
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I always found it kind of funny that CW had huge projects planned for both Oyster Bay and Plainview and was shot down big time. How come that was never an issue? Where were all of the blogs letters and demonstrations when CW was told to take a hike then? This is all about keeping the Isles lets be honest. I respect that but other then the possibility of losing my hockey team how much effect will this project really have?? And if it is huge why hasnt anyone jumped all over the locals for tossing CW and his ideas out of Plainview and Oyster Bay?
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They don’t jump all over the locals. Bit by bit, they just take their business — and their lives — elsewhere. You are arguing that an area goes into decline in a series of loud apocalyptic showdowns between those who want change and those who want to preserve the past. That’s not the way it happens. The data shows that is happening here.
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One of the sides is going to have to relent a little bit. We all know the Wanger isn’t going to, he has made that quite clear already. I am for the lighthouse but his plans are a little ambitious, I do think it will be nothing but a positive for the community but because of the size of his plan can see the hold up. The tiniest of projects get held up on the Island, there will be no exception with this one.
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Last post on this, as I want to abide by the blog rules, but Wang would not have anything to lose if he filed for bankruptcy. Mario got the Pens because he was the largest creditor, from back salary, and the owners walked away. Nobody says you have to walk away, Trump has used bankruptcy numerous times with his AC properties, and he still owns them all.
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OK im onboard We must build Old Plainview as CW has instructed!!! I think it is time we all band together and fight for Old Plainview to be built right now. for those who dont know…Old Plainview was CW version of the lighthouse to be built in Plainview LI. There was so much outcry from the people in that area that did not want that built in their community that CW woke up and pulled his application for the use of the land. There was no fanfare no public hangings just CW waking up and realizing people gave him a bigtime thumbs down! The land for Old Plainview sits basiclly empty today. WE need Old Plainview NOW!!! yea i am a bit sarcastic at times
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i don’t get how you people look outside your windows and drive along the l.i.e. and think that long island is some sort of little country paradise. try to build the lighthouse off of montauk and you have a point. but not in the middle of the “dump” that uniondale, levittown, east meadow is. i think some of you need to travel to other places to understand what a nice area really is. there’s no going back to what long island could have been. that concrete jungle has passed. the lighthouse would improve that dump tremendously.
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I don’t think anyone is arguing with you Dommy Hempstead is a dump and will turn into an even bigger one if this doesn’t go through.
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Aim, it doesn’t help your point when it’s rife with sarcasm and assumes that your opinion counts more than mine. Seriously, for all future discussions, drop the season ticket holder BS, because it doesn’t make your opinion more valuable than anyone else’s here.
You still haven’t answered my question about your alternative plan. Your big issues are the size of a tower and underground parking? If nothing else the underground units could provide more exits to the street instead of the few choke-points currently there. As for the towers, JayK laid it out pretty well. It was a scaled-back compromise (not dictating) because the 60-story building was a bridge too far for many people. Fair enough. However, I believe Mr. Wang intends it to be a symbol of Long Island’s future; I asked him about it at an Islanders open house over the summer and he told me how much it bothered him that the Ref-Fuel smokestack is the tallest structure in Nassau/Suffolk, and he wants to change that.
To review, your objections are towers that are a compromise to begin with and parking structures that can’t be avoided. In addition, you still haven’t said anything about other ideas, only inferring that those who support the project are blind sheep. As for the density, that same Long Island Index published a survey in early 2008 showing that 61% of Long Islanders surveyed favored high-density housing in downtown areas. Old Plainview was a pipe dream project on a sub-optimal plot of land. The Lighthouse is meant to be a full community center on prime real estate with parkway, main road, and (potential) mass transit access. Apples to oranges.
JayK is also right that we’re in a battle for the very future of our island. People won’t suddenly wake up one day and decide that Long Island is doomed. However, over the years Long Island has become notorious for high taxes, high burdens on citizens, and no vision. We need to show foresight and stand up for the future. The current brain drain and aging populations model will not hold, regardless of how fervently some people may wish it was still 1959 rather than 2009.
I’ve said this many times – the world is changing, and it won’t wait for us to catch up.
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matt… i know it’s obvious to you and me and many others but i’m amazed there are still people who look at what’s there now and what it could be and still cringe at the idea of having a few tall buildings. it’s not like they will be blocking a view of a grand mountain view or nyc skyline. i live in LA now. I can see a view of downtown from my balcony and the hollywood sign. if something went up to block it i’d be annoyed. but there’s nothing like that there. in fact if this thing went up people would start to brag about how close they live to it and how nice it looks. it would become something that people would be proud of.
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isles72 says:
lil off topic here but I was kinda baffled when I heard that the Coyotes have a terrible lease and its one of the reasons they are bleeding
uhhhhh , didnt they just move into that new arena ?I dont get it
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cgs878 says:
I don’t know what to say anymore. I hate the way things are done on Long Island, but I can’t change anything either. I’ll just pay my ridiculous taxes and hope that my house doubles in value again in the next 10 years. Then, I’ll be able to move away from this crappy Island and be free of the NIMBY, what’s in it for me attitudes of the local politicians. I used to love Long Island, but now I just tolerate it. What a shame.
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CGS – that’s the problem on one level. So many people who could speak with their votes and take a stand don’t out of defeatism (not necessarily saying you’re doing this, but your comment triggered my thinking about this). What’s the old saying – the worst part of a tragedy is when good people do nothing?
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Tom says:
The Isles could start the 2009-10 season in KC if they want. All this yapping that they “can’t move” or “won’t move” is so wrong, so naive it IS funny! Laugh or cry? Isles fans laugh! Because Isles aren’t worth crying over. Not any more.
God helps those who helps themselves. You think the Wilpons, the Mara’s, Steinbrenner’s, the Modell’s, the Davis’, even the swine The Milstein’s would stand for this treatment? Hell no. Pride. Wang’s got none.
The Isles have no pride. Top to bottom the org is 30th in every category and they couldn’t care less. The powers that be have been playing with the Isles & making them look like bumbling fools.
FIGHT BACK. But Islander fans don’t get your hopes up, this an org that lacks the pride & the ambition to win.
They’ve been a doormat for so long, they think it’s the natural order of things. Who am I to complain?
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art says:
this storey was placed in Newsday for a reason. it is to create a buzz about how uncertain the isles and the lighthouse future really is. we all know the message now complete chaos and guessing. but there should be no guessing about why newsday broke the story -their owners and masters cablevision and the dolans want them 86 as in diner parlance simply stated one less nhl team in the metro area
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NYC NYI Fan says:
Does anyone have actual terms of lease, or link to PDF of lease?
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Art, you clearly didn’t read Neil Best’s column about two weeks ago about why the disapperance of the Islanders would be bad news for the Dolans.
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Dmarie says:
Ok..I took a break from all this for a few days. But I read the article in Newsday, and I laughed when they stated that if Charles Wang breaks this lease? he could face major fines and even prison!..prison?
yea, ok.. lets put a Man in jail who’s trying to rebuild the Arena an it’s surrounding area, create jobs, all positive things for a community not to mention LI as well, and the residents want this project too and rightly so, they live there, it means good things for them yea..that makes sense, UGG! I guess if you think like a politician it would..for them it’s all about the money, the power trips, it’s never about the TAX payers, you know? the ones who end up paying for all their mistakes! please!
They just don’t want Wang taking credit for improving things for their residents they should have a long time ago, and why? one reason they claim is because he’s not a resident of LI?..wtf? who cares!..he’s willing to make improvements! Wangs Lawyers should sue to break the lease because it’s a dump!..
I agree, CB…if the team and the NHL want to break the lease and it is in their financial interests to do so, the lease terms will present an issue not an impediment…that’s what you have lawyers for (or so I’m told)